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Stevie G

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It's pretty sad to watch his deterioration.

I know we've lost Can and Lucas is balls but we need to be able to pull him from matches when we're chasing the game- he looked like a dead weight at times on Saturday.

I genuinely don't think he would be in the best Xi, it possibly highlights inadequacies in our squad as he still features so much. Can you drop a player like Stevie? I'm not sure it'd do wonders for the squad moral his own ego but his experience and nurturing of younglings is certainly outweighed by his ability on match days.

I don't envy Brendan but he has a tough decision to make
 
Yes he is still ridiculously talented, but when out game relies on high pressure and an ability to close down, I just can't see him being comfortable.

Henderson can't babysit him by doing all the leg work.
 
He should have been subbed for Lucas? Dunno, fucking anyone really. I don't have a problem with him starting but Rodgers seems to refuse to sub him even when necessary in a game. This needs to change
 
Fully agree. There are certain games for Stevie. Against a young, hungry, hard-pressing team like Villa, Saturday wasn't one of those games.

When we were chasing the game, he was just sat on the CBs hovering, picking up the ball off their toes, making up no ground with his positioning. He looked like an old man on holiday not wanting to stray too far from the tour bus. He should have been subbed. Even Lucas, for the last 30mins, would have probably been more dynamic.
 
The least he deserves is a few more games before fans rush to definitive judgements.
Mine is long term, I wasn't convinced of his defensive capabilities last year either. Whilst he can still contribute, I'm feeling more and more like he's in the Xi because he's Steven Gerrard, rather than what the team needs
 
Well I think that's a perfectly justifiable concern, and I've had it myself for some time, but I still want to see him given a chance to (re)prove his worth. He's always been an attacking, aggressive, positive player, which is why I agree that he's just not suited temperamentally to his current role, but I still HOPE to see him tried further up the field.
 
I think the time has come to drop him, he hasnt played a good game this season despite a 2 week rest while most of our squad was on international duty. Fortunately for Rodgers I expect him to start midweek and then be too tired for the weekend. 3 games in a week would be too much for him.
 
One trademark Lucas foul and we'll all be begging for Gerrard to come back, some trademark grass is greener shit going on here, okay maybe that's slightly harsh, but Gerrard wasn't the problem yesterday, he does need to be managed though, needs to sit out more games this year.
 
Rodgers hasn't got the nuts to drop him. If he's fit, he'll play every PL game. It'll be gerrard that makes the call as to when he's not playing.
He's turning into a bit of a luxury player, he's going to end up compromising his legacy if it goes on. No one wants to remember gerrard for his last few wanky seasons.
 
I didn't think Gerrard was the problem in this particular match, although I only saw the first half and bits and pieces of the second.

It's a strange one. In his new position, we need him to be discipline, to trust his attackers, to not take on too much himself and be a cog in the machine. I thought he was far worse against Chelsea, the last time we were chasing a game at home. Then he took too much on and forcing it too much.
 
It's obvious that @gkmacca is right, so blindingly obvious that I think only Rodgers ego or bloody mindedness is preventing him realising it.

Gerrard needs to play the 'lampard role'. Let's face it, Coutinho has done fuck all in that elusive number 10 position.

Whilst Stevie can't do those long range blasting shots he used to, he can whip dangerous balls that trouble keepers into towards the net, he can take the ball past players & his positional sense & awareness can't have faded with his pace.

Lampard under Mourinho the first time used to play games for Chelsea where he'd only run in a 25 yard square area cos the rest of the side could do the running & he'd play home the advantage in that telling area.

Stevie could do that all day long, & even at his worst would be a marked improvement on what Coutinho has been giving us.

Now we have Moreno & Manquillo offering the ability to genuinely travel with the ball down both flanks, & Henderson is always eager to try to long looping balls, him distributing from deep can be substituted relatively simply.

The only thing stopping this (other than Rodgers deciding of course) is Gerrard himself trying to do all the box to box running he used to, & his discipline in the dm role surely proves he can do that.
 
I thought we bought Lallana for that elusive number 10 role though @FoxForceFive

We're heavily stacked in the attack, whilst slim on the ground for DM. Rodgers is shoe Horning him in and hoping it'll work.

I'm hoping can is going to displace Gerrard by seasons end
 
This is based off the 2014 year as a whole Macca.

He's very clever, very talented and no doubt a great presence in the squad - I just think he will hamper our top 4 chances if we continue playing him in the frequency, position etc we have.

I think the world cup was the clincher for me. He was the one of (if not) the worst on the pitch in each game he played, utterly anonymous, which is a crying shame

I'm all for releasing him from defensive duties and letting him loose further up the field / replacing Lambert, I just don't like watching him perform the way he frequently has.

This qb/ pirlo chat needs binning off pronto
 
Actually thought he was okay against Villa, but on the balance of the last year or so, I agree.
 
He's our heartbeat and our captain. We've already got half a dozen new players desperately trying to find their feet. The last thing we need is to drop our longest serving player, regardless of the odd poor performance. 5 years ago he'd have dragged us back into that game. Now we need other highly paid professionals to step up and take the game by the scruff of the neck. We're so used to relying on him for the past decade that when he's ordinary everyone thinks he's past it. Plenty left in there, would prefer him further up the park and a world class DM in front of our supposed back four. But BR sees it differently.
 
He's our heartbeat and our captain. We've already got half a dozen new players desperately trying to find their feet. The last thing we need is to drop our longest serving player, regardless of the odd poor performance. 5 years ago he'd have dragged us back into that game. Now we need other highly paid professionals to step up and take the game by the scruff of the neck. We're so used to relying on him for the past decade that when he's ordinary everyone thinks he's past it. Plenty left in there, would prefer him further up the park and a world class DM in front of our supposed back four. But BR sees it differently.


Noble, but United dropped Robson, Keane, Scholes, Giggs, and more over the years and still won leagues.
Same for plenty of other sides.

All this captain and heartbeat shite wins you fuck all. He cost us several times last season, and is costing us again this season. I'm not saying we should drop him necessarily, but there's a shelf life on Gerrard the clock's fucking ticking as far as I'm concerned.
 
It's all good and well saying he should be dropped, but for who?

Lucas? Please not. Gerrard is actually good at some things and offers something.

Allen? Not really his position, although he could probably do it fairly decently if given a run of games.

Henderson? Would be like asking a border collie to stay at your side in a field of sheep

Can? Perhaps, but very young in a role that usually requires experience and a certain street smartness. (Makelele, Hamann)

I'd stick with Stevie. But he needs sitting out quite often. Which gives the chance of giving Can and Allen a go at the role. If its still a problem at the end of the season, its got to be our big purchase.
 
I'd like to see him played almost like toure, sit deep for most of the game then if we need it move him into a more attacking position for the last 10-20 mins, its interesting that he never shoots anymore, even when playing further forward, it would be a shame if thats something he's been told to cut out, mind you maybe he just gets flashbacks to chelsea when he shot at every opportunity and they were all shite
 
Part of the problem must be whoever our sports "scientists" are that feed him all this bullshit about his fitness levels being as good as ever. I get the feeling they don't know what they're doing and they're not scientists.

When he was younger he'd carry the whole team through games, so it is no surprise his stats in training were affected by his exhaustion form the match. Right now he is walking through games, so again it's no surprise his training stats are great because he isn't shattered every Monday morning. The club are basically kidding him. If the true situation was explained to him I doubt there would be an ego problem, he'd happily sit out more games.
 
Noble, but United dropped Robson, Keane, Scholes, Giggs, and more over the years and still won leagues.
Same for plenty of other sides.

All this captain and heartbeat shite wins you fuck all. He cost us several times last season, and is costing us again this season. I'm not saying we should drop him necessarily, but there's a shelf life on Gerrard the clock's fucking ticking as far as I'm concerned.

Nobody is undroppable and everyone has a shelf life, of course. But being the heartbeat of a team and it's captain counts for a lot. It's myopic to think otherwise. We all saw what a difference decent sports psychology can do for a team last season, so having a presence like him on the field makes a huge difference, obviously( He probably makes a massive difference off the field and in training too, which you can't always do if you're dumped on the bench as your status plummets). Unless, that is, he's having a negative influence on the team. He's carried the team for years, and we should all be fucking appreciative of that, but if the team starts to carry him, then yeh, maybe it's time to change things.

For me personally, it's not quite at that point yet.
 
I wish Rodgers would play him further up and say to him, 'Go out and show me you can still perform, consistently, in that position". Then if he can't, work with him on what's best to go forward - occasional Bryan Robson-style impact performances in the old position, a much more disciplined defensive role or a spell on the bench. Psychologically I don't think he's come to terms with the change.
 
You're right on the psychology thing in my eyes. We all love to play football manager from our armchairs and laptops, which is great fun and part of being a fan, but there's so much we simply don't know about that is no doubt going to affect the team in numerous ways. Not to say that excuses team and manager from criticism of course, but things aren't always as black and white as we'd like to think they are.
 
Did no-one see Carra and Nevilles analysis last night on Monday night Football?

They highlighted Villas tactic of sticking Agbonlahor on Gerrard at all times and stopping him getting the ball. It was quite interesting to see and something I didnt notice when watching the game. Carra also said that we should be looking at using Stevie in a different role, either switching with Henderson for periods of the game, or playing him as a number 10. He must have been listening to Macca.
 
All this captain and heartbeat shite wins you fuck all. He cost us several times last season, and is costing us again this season. I'm not saying we should drop him necessarily, but there's a shelf life on Gerrard the clock's fucking ticking as far as I'm concerned.

But then you haven't actually said anything at all then. Because you haven't committed to dropping him, or to changing his position, or have said to leave him be where he is for the time being, that in itself being a commitment. So which is it ?
 
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