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Transfer strategy

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iseered

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There is a lot of nonsense being spouted in various threads about transfers, so I think we need a thread to get a few things straight.

1. "I don't care how much he costs"

That you are not personally interested in the commercial side of football is perfectly understandable. Or maybe you are just making a point about how desirable a player is. But when seriously evaluating a transfer, the cost of it is obviously massively fucking key.

Comments like "it is not like you have to pay it yourself" is a clear indicator of either trolling or mental health issues.

2. "He is Premiership proven"

Again cost is the key. All clubs have limited funds (bar maybe a handful). LFC has limited funds. So in every transfer we make we are looking to get maximum bang for our buck.

Having played in the Premiership seems to add to a players perceived value - if the buying club is also in the Premier League. And why not? The player has shown he can play in the very league you are competing in, of course that is valuable.

But if the perceived value goes up, then the price also goes up. And as both the seller and the buyer knows that the player is Premiership proven, there is no value in it. You might as well list "having a right foot" as an important attribute for a player. It is not a big plus unless the seller has Alzheimer.

3. "You just want a foreign fancy dan"

Of course we can look for good transfer targets in the Premier League - we would be stupid not to. But it is one of the hardest places in the world to find value, due to the massive exposure. The tourists at the table are perhaps Man City and Chelsea, who are able and willing to absorb massive losses to get the shiniest toys. But for the rest it is purely about value for money.

In this situation we should of course focus on scouring the globe for talent, and not just hang around City and Chelsea in the hope they forget a Sturridge on the bus again.
 
Genuine question here but would people care about how much we spend on players if we had a sugar daddy?
 
Genuine question here but would people care about how much we spend on players if we had a sugar daddy?

Not really. I mean, I wouldnt want us to waste 35m on someone, but I wouldnt really care if we could afford to spend that again 3 or 4 times the same year.
 
I find it strange that the same people who don't want us to pay top dollar for players are the same people who want us to challenge for the title. Tell me, out of the three teams that have won the title in the last five years, which one skimps out of paying for the best players? The answer in none, if you're not prepared to pay for the best players, you'll end up like Arsenal at very best.
 
I find it strange that the same people who don't want us to pay top dollar for players are the same people who want us to challenge for the title. Tell me, out of the three teams that have won the title in the last five years, which one skimps out of paying for the best players? The answer in none, if you're not prepared to pay for the best players, you'll end up like Arsenal at very best.
So Lallana is now "the best player"?
Comparable to who? Van Persie?
 
Did I say he was the best player? Or are you jumping to conclusions again?


In fairness, it's not an unreasonable conclusion to jump to given that the Lallana is the main topic of conversation right now.

I'm not really sure who doesn't want us to pay top dollar for players. The main issue is that often people don't agree on who is deserving of our dollars.
 
I find it strange that the same people who don't want us to pay top dollar for players are the same people who want us to challenge for the title. Tell me, out of the three teams that have won the title in the last five years, which one skimps out of paying for the best players? The answer in none, if you're not prepared to pay for the best players, you'll end up like Arsenal at very best.

Let us say you have x to spend this summer. Do you want to spend it good or do you want spend it bad? Would you agree that good means getting as talented players as possible in the positions you require, for the amount of money you have at your disposal?
 
Yeah, I don't begrudge us going out and spending shitloads on someone obviously brilliant. While Lallana is a great idea and a good prospect for us to go for, the price is causing the divisiveness. Partly because he's only just come to prominence in the last two seasons (at the pinnacle of the game) and because we've had our fingers burnt before.

I do think it's a bit retarded to take the "well it's not my money" stance when we're clearly working within a restricted financial setup, comparatively. Of course there's a knock on effect. Say we value Lallana at £15m but we're willing to stretch to £20m, Southampton know the going rate is £20m so they push their luck asking for £25m, then he has a good World Cup and everyone goes overboard again and suddenly it's a £30m fee. It's a forever distorted market, because even a single game can alter the perception of someones worth.

The top of this profession is cut-throat. Look at Yaya Toure, one of the best players we've seen in recent years in the Prem, a player anyone would take in a heartbeat. He goes to PSG tomorrow and he's suddenly yesterday's news as far as we're all concerned. It's that finely balanced, so you can see why people are cautious against being stung out of anything between £5m-£15m, just because latest form/reputation/media impressions dictate as such.

I like Lallana and think he's a wonderfully gifted footballer, he'd add depth to the side, give us an alternative as well as an accompaniment to players like Coutinho and Sterling, but there has to always be a line that you go to, otherwise you lose focus of the overall picture. The knock on effect of not being able to buy that £15m left back, coz you've just spent an extra £10m on that midfielder, all because he had a great game at the World Cup, or because the selling club know you've got the money AND form.

I want us to be ambitious, but there has to be an area of sanity between going the extra 10 yards for a player and standing up for yourself against a club and market that's clearly taking the fucking piss.
 
@iseered - "Comments like "it is not like you have to pay it yourself" is a clear indicator of either trolling or mental health issues."

I presume that little dig is aimed at me.

Firstly that's not a nice thing to say to anyone by the way. Secondly we don't have to have the same view on what way you support LFC. I tend to not worry too much about transfers because I'm not the one making the decisions. It's not like I can phone Anfield and say 'He's too expensive - What are you thinking?' There is nothing I can do whether I want to or not. I just sit back and enjoy the match as much as I can.

I suppose debate is healthy and that's all part of the forum but don't fucking judge me on how I decide to support the club.
 
I suppose debate is healthy and that's all part of the forum but don't fucking judge me on how I decide to support the club.

I don't think anyone is thinking that deeply about it mate (the jokey, snide comment aside), I think it's just a generalistic view. We get all sides of it on here, we get people moaning we haven't spent £30m on Johnny Foreigner, people moaning at the end of August that we still haven't filled hole X, we get people moaning that Spurs have signed 10 players and we've only signed 3.... it's never ending. I think to some degree, given finances are such an integral part of the game, that your overall expectation should be in someway in tandem with whatever budget you've got and how you use it.
 
Genuine question here but would people care about how much we spend on players if we had a sugar daddy?


We'd have the same conversations because judging (or at least trying to) a players value is part of what the transfer window is all about. It'd just matter less.
 
I don't think anyone is thinking that deeply about it mate (the jokey, snide comment aside), I think it's just a generalistic view. We get all sides of it on here, we get people moaning we haven't spent £30m on Johnny Foreigner, people moaning at the end of August that we still haven't filled hole X, we get people moaning that Spurs have signed 10 players and we've only signed 3.... it's never ending. I think to some degree, given finances are such an integral part of the game, that your overall expectation should be in someway in tandem with whatever budget you've got and how you use it.
I'm not that arsed really - I just don't like being called 'mental' or 'retarded' because I try not to let things that I have no control over bother me. Each to their own I guess.

*Heads over to the General Chat Forum to post a recipe* ;)
 
We'd have the same conversations because judging (or at least trying to) a players value is part of what the transfer window is all about. It'd just matter less.
True.
I'd be curious to know what the city fans were saying when they were spunking 20s of millions on the likes of Lescott,Rodwell,Santa Cruz etc etc.
Was it 'i can't believe we are spending that much on so or so' or was it 'who cares we have loads of it anyway'.
Even now I'd say they don't care considering the spending won the two titles in 3 years.
 
If we were going to win the title by buying player X then no one could complain. The fact is one player is unlikely to make that difference. Our budget, whatever it is its less tham Chelsea and City, dictates that we have to be cleverer with it than others do. We cant afford expensive mistakes, its what cost us over the past 10 years and it will again while we have a limited budget.
 
RA, you are one of the least mental-crazy people on these boards. In fact you are in my utterly sane top 10. If you are a closet fruit and nutcase, then I'm going back to the drawing board on all things life related!
 
RA, you are one of the least mental-crazy people on these boards. In fact you are in my utterly sane top 10. If you are a closet fruit and nutcase, then I'm going back to the drawing board on all things life related!
Thanks mate - Likewise. It's all good. :)
 
I think Mark's post is bang on.
For me, it's all about balance. We have relatively limited funds, and many holes to fill. It's not like we're two or three signings away from winning the league. Of course I'd love to just go out and buy nothing but top quality players, but then that removes funds that may have been available to add depth to the squad or strengthen other areas if we just go out and spend £30mill each on a couple or three top players.
Saying you don't care what he costs is just short sighted crap. Unless you have bottomless pockets, which we clearly don't, when you lose £20 mill on and Andy Carroll, that's a top winger we now have to go without, or a couple of good defenders. Etc etc etc.
the balance is identifying the right talent and paying a sensible price. Not saying we should walk away from every deal unless it's a bargain, but just to be prudent with who we buy and what we pay.
Prem proven does make a difference to me. It's hard to see why anyone would argue otherwise. Is it worth a huge premium? Probably not, but a premium nonetheless.
Lallana at 20 mill is a deal I'd take. 30? Nah. That's ten mill that could easily be spent somewhere else in the squad to seriously boost a whole other position, with a 20 mill alternative to fill Lallanas shoes.
 
@Red Astaire, not being interested in the financial side of things is fine. Maybe even commendable.
I am interested. Anything to do with the club interests me of course. Someone pointed out about the ownership thing in 2010 earlier. I was one of the reds stood outside the Royal Courts Of Justice that day sending messages through to 6CM when the 'epic swindle' was finally sorted. I'm not saying I'm a superfan or anything I was just in the neighbourhood.

I care loads when it comes to the success of the club. When it comes to transfers though I've learnt to be a bit more stoic about them and take the rough with the smooth. The club will pay what they think and if they do end up paying whatever it is I'll debate about it then.

Expending thought about it right now is a bit of a waste for me.
 
I find it strange that the same people who don't want us to pay top dollar for players are the same people who want us to challenge for the title. Tell me, out of the three teams that have won the title in the last five years, which one skimps out of paying for the best players? The answer in none, if you're not prepared to pay for the best players, you'll end up like Arsenal at very best.


That is such a daft post. We're not in the position of Chelsea, Utd, or City. If we were basing our faith in our ability to challenge for the title on the last 3 winners we'd conclude we had no chance anyway and give it up.
 
That is such a daft post. We're not in the position of Chelsea, Utd, or City. If we were basing our faith in our ability to challenge for the title on the last 3 winners we'd conclude we had no chance anyway and give it up.
That's not what I'm saying, I'm saying we have to be prepared to pay a premium to get the best players, we can't always expect to get a bargain, don't get extorted, sure, but pay a little bit more to get your first choice, otherwise we'll never push on to the very top.
 
In fairness, it's not an unreasonable conclusion to jump to given that the Lallana is the main topic of conversation right now.

I'm not really sure who doesn't want us to pay top dollar for players. The main issue is that often people don't agree on who is deserving of our dollars.
I was referring to our first choice targets, Lallana hadn't been mentioned, but his sure is the hot topic right now.
 
Good stuff, now what's the latest on your neighbours. Did you get to the bottom of it. :)
Ha ha - Only that more people keep showing up at Number 14. An elderly chap keeps driving up now. More recon work needs to be done. I'll figure it out. :ninja:
 
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