Trent Alexander-Amazing

[Frogfish]

But seriously, it's faaaaaaar too soon to compare him with those guys. Sure Trent has been amazing but those 4 have had amazing careers filled with prestigious honours, Trent isn't there yet.

All of them are better atm.
Have the discussion after he retires.

I never get this ... someone won X amount of trophies therefore obviously Player X is better than Player Y. Could we say that when comparing someone with Gerrard simply because he didn't win the PL or a WC or Euro? You can be a brilliant player but play for a mediocre club. And vice versa look at the role call of shite players that have a CL, PL or WC winners medal to their name (or more than one) !

It's not off base to say that TAA is reaching that level even though still only 21.

I have never seen the likes of him before, because there has never been a player of his ilk before, a RB that can not only has the technical skills of superb control, inter passing, pace, stamina, free kicks, shooting and incredible crossing but can, in every game, put 40-60m passes onto a sixpence across field. His defending may not be up to that of a Lahm or Thuram but their skills were not at his level in other areas. He is a phenomenon and it's made all the sweeter that he comes from the city and only wants to stay here and become a legend.

 

[Dreambeliever]

I never get this ... someone won X amount of trophies therefore obviously Player X is better than Player Y. Could we say that when comparing someone with Gerrard simply because he didn't win the PL or a WC or Euro? You can be a brilliant player but play for a mediocre club. And vice versa look at the role call of shite players that have a CL, PL or WC winners medal to their name (or more than one) !

It's not off base to say that TAA is reaching that level even though still only 21.

I have never seen the likes of him before, because there has never been a player of his ilk before, a RB that can not only has the technical skills of superb control, inter passing, pace, stamina, free kicks, shooting and incredible crossing but can, in every game, put 40-60m passes onto a sixpence across field. His defending may not be up to that of a Lahm or Thuram but their skills were not at his level in other areas. He is a phenomenon and it's made all the sweeter that he comes from the city and only wants to stay here and become a legend.

The fact they performed at the highest level for a decade or longer is why it’s stupid to compare them.

 

[Frogfish]

The fact they performed at the highest level for a decade or longer is why it’s stupid to compare them.

Hmm but that's not an indicator of the apogee of their quality, just longevity. Which has to be worth something but it's not the same as their absolute zenith (which it's possible TAA may not even have reached yet).

If we ran a spreadsheet and assigned points for each skill they possess I doubt (m)any would be much clear of TAA at this moment. They each had different strengths of course so it's also what you are looking for in a FB, and there is no doubt the qualities/priorities required of a modern day FB have changed, but I would struggle to make a case for any of those to be superior overall.

 

[Modo]

Hmm but that's not an indicator of the apogee of their quality, just longevity. Which has to be worth something but it's not the same as their absolute zenith (which it's possible TAA may not even have reached yet).

If we ran a spreadsheet and assigned points for each skill they possess I doubt (m)any would be much clear of TAA at this moment. They each had different strengths of course so it's also what you are looking for in a FB, and there is no doubt the qualities/priorities required of a modern day FB have changed, but I would struggle to make a case for any of those to be superior overall.

In the case of those listed, they played at he highest level into their 30's and were still winning trophies and playing for their respective national teams. I'm sorry, it's not just only about longevity. They were quality throughout. Fucking hell, Alves just won best player of the tournament at Copa America that Brazil won and he's fucking 36 or something.
When he's 26 still winning trophies and assisting goals like crazy I'll add him to the list of best right backs of all time. But imo he'll be in midfield by then.

 

[Frogfish]

In the case of those listed, they played at he highest level into their 30's and were still winning trophies and playing for their respective national teams. I'm sorry, it's not just only about longevity. They were quality throughout. Fucking hell, Alves just won best player of the tournament at Copa America that Brazil won and he's fucking 36 or something.
When he's 26 still winning trophies and assisting goals like crazy I'll add him to the list of best right backs of all time. But imo he'll be in midfield by then.

Well I've already covered the bit about winning trophies or playing for national teams and as I said the zenith in quality is definitely not about longevity, so I'm not sure why you go on to use that as proof of something ? Are you saying that Alves is, at this moment, a better player than TAA ? If not then your last paragraph is irrelevant isn't it (impressive though it is as a standalone fact).

Just by your comment " when he's 26 still winning trophies ..." shows that your parameters are somewhat different to mine and are not based on an individual's peak prowess but on longevity and on factors beyond an individual's control which actually have no significance with regard to his own level.

 

[Mamma Mia]

Still wouldn't swap him for any of them, even in their prime.

 

[My_Blood_Bleeds_Red]

How dare you choose someone who’s only 21 and haven’t won a lot yet ?

It’s stupid.

Choose again after 10 years.

 

[Modo]

Well I've already covered the bit about winning trophies or playing for national teams and as I said the zenith in quality is definitely not about longevity, so I'm not sure why you go on to use that as proof of something ? Are you saying that Alves is, at this moment, a better player than TAA ? If not then your last paragraph is irrelevant isn't it (impressive though it is as a standalone fact).

Just by your comment " when he's 26 still winning trophies ..." shows that your parameters are somewhat different to mine and are not based on an individual's peak prowess but on longevity and on factors beyond an individual's control which actually have no significance with regard to his own level.

No, it's a combination of quality and longevity. Trent has the quality but he needs to keep it at that level for as long as the others did in my opinion.
It's like a Babbel v Finnan comparison. Who was better. Imo Babbel was the better player but Finnan kept a top quality standard for us longer. So it's a combination of quality and longevity.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Hmm but that's not an indicator of the apogee of their quality, just longevity. Which has to be worth something but it's not the same as their absolute zenith (which it's possible TAA may not even have reached yet).

If we ran a spreadsheet and assigned points for each skill they possess I doubt (m)any would be much clear of TAA at this moment. They each had different strengths of course so it's also what you are looking for in a FB, and there is no doubt the qualities/priorities required of a modern day FB have changed, but I would struggle to make a case for any of those to be superior overall.

Are you serious? They didn’t just play for over a decade they played at the biggest clubs winning the biggest honours playing by and large superbly every year.

Trent has a long way to do to be discussed like that.
Sure he’s been amazing for two years but he’ll need to be like this for 10 years. Let’s talk about it then

 

[Frogfish]

No, it's a combination of quality and longevity. Trent has the quality but he needs to keep it at that level for as long as the others did in my opinion.
It's like a Babbel v Finnan comparison. Who was better. Imo Babbel was the better player but Finnan kept a top quality standard for us longer. So it's a combination of quality and longevity.

That's your opinion so it's not 'No'. As I said you are applying different parameters where in your mind longevity matters (and we wil just have to agree to differ on the parameters).

In fact though you have undermined your position by saying Babbel was better than Finnan. Which is exactly my point with TAA. TAA is a drag car doing 300mph for 800m not an F1 doing 180mph for 70 laps. However since it's TAA he could well end up doing 300mph for 70 laps !

 

[Frogfish]

Are you serious? They didn’t just play for over a decade they played at the biggest clubs winning the biggest honours playing by and large superbly every year.

Trent has a long way to do to be discussed like that.
Sure he’s been amazing for two years but he’ll need to be like this for 10 years. Let’s talk about it then

Christ Almighty. I've explained the parameters I'm using a dozen times, how can you still not to get it ? If you want to include longevity and medals won that's your prerogative but it's largely irrelevant when considering a players peak prowess.

I've stated clearly that as far as I'm concerned, and what should be obvious, is what a player wins with a team is irrelevant to his own level, there are dozens of average ability United players, with a handful of PL winner's medals, that can prove this point. As for longevity that's again irrelevant to a player's peak performance, you could play for 100 years but that still doesn't mean you would ever be the best.

One point I would add though is that I am talking about the modern game as it is today, not 10 or 20 years ago.

 

[Modo]

Ok I concede.

 

[tombrown]

Christ Almighty. I've explained the parameters I'm using a dozen times, how can you still not to get it ? If you want to include longevity and medals won that's your prerogative but it's largely irrelevant when considering a players peak prowess.

I've stated clearly that as far as I'm concerned, and what should be obvious, is what a player wins with a team is irrelevant to his own level, there are dozens of average ability United players, with a handful of PL winner's medals, that can prove this point. As for longevity that's again irrelevant to a player's peak performance, you could play for 100 years but that still doesn't mean you would ever be the best.

One point I would add though is that I am talking about the modern game as it is today, not 10 or 20 years ago.

Yes, but you're forgetting that unless you use DB's own exact rules then you will be wrong in his eyes, regardless of whatever explanations and caveats you put around it.

 

[Farkmaster]

I think, understandably, that everyone has gone a little overboard about TAA.

Not that he isn't brilliant, and not that his development isn't incredibly exciting given his age.

But for a lot of the beginning of this season, he looked defensively weak, and completely out of sorts. His delivery was hit and miss. Then he recovered form.

Sometimes he looks to hit the hollywood ball too much, like Gerrard. He can often be on the wrong side of his man. He's an incredibly impressive player, but there's tons of consistency and maturity that will improve him.

 

[binomial]

He has a lot of his all round game need he need to improve on.

But he is #2 in the league only behind KDB as the best passer/crosser of the ball.

Defensively he gets run past far too often.

 

[peekay]

 

[King Binny]

Dated 28 Dec 2019

 

[King Binny]

 

[King Binny]

[article]Brazil legend Cafu recognises a kindred spirit in Liverpool’s rampaging right-back Trent Alexander-Arnold.

Two-time World Cup winner Cafu, who lifted domestic titles in his homeland as well as the Champions League during a glittering career, says the Scouser, 21, plays the game with a Samba style.

He already rates Alexander-Arnold as one of the best players in the world.

And he believes the England international can go on to be a future Ballon d’Or winner.

Cafu said: “I think Alexander-Arnold is one of the best in the world, no doubt about it.

“He’s a great player – and I would say he has the same characteristics as I did.

“He has got big potential. He is strong and skilful, he really takes the game forward and he’s a player who sets up goals for Liverpool .

“So, yes, I can see lots of similarities between him and me when I was playing.

“I would say he’s got a Brazilian instinct in the way he plays.

“My advice for him is simple: just keep doing what you have been doing for the last few years.

“Alexander-Arnold shouldn’t change his way of playing. Even if he makes mistakes, he should carry on doing what he’s doing.

“I think he has what it takes to become a Ballon d’Or winner.

“We have to change this paradigm where the Ballon d’Or is only won by attackers and strikers.

“People have to see that defenders are just as important as attackers.”

Alexander-Arnold has become king of the assists at Anfield as Jurgen Klopp aims to clinch the club’s first Premier League title after lifting the Champions League last year.

He has set up 28 goals in the last two seasons – and it has been suggested that any defensive flaws in his game could be overcome by pushing him into a midfield role.

Cafu is not so sure.

He said: “It is Alexander-Arnold’s natural instinct to attack – and it is also the way Liverpool play.

“This is one of his characteristics and he must not lose that. The defensive side depends a lot on the way the team play.

“Liverpool are a team that play on the attack, so he’s extremely important for their style.

“The role of full-back suits him better and I think he now has to get even better at doing what he already knows how to do.

“He has to play like one of the great full-backs, adapt to the position, become the best full-back in the world and then maybe there could be some sort of adaptation in terms of midfield.

“But, for now at least, he has to be the best full-back he can be.”

Cafu is a big admirer of the job Klopp has done at Anfield.

The Brazilian will be in Berlin on Sunday for the 20th Laureus Awards in his role as a Laureus Academy member, when the Reds will be in the running to win the Team of the Year prize.

Liverpool have also been nominated for the Comeback of the Year for their thrilling 4-3 aggregate victory over Barcelona in the semi-finals of the Champions League.

And Cafu said: “Liverpool had an incredible season last year and they are repeating that this time. I think they deserve their nomination.

“The comeback against Barca was unbelievable and Klopp deserves 100 per cent of the credit for how the team has now grown so well.”[/article]

 

[737Max]

Wasn't long ago he was wanking lyrical about Jon Flanaghan

 

[darkstarexodus]

Wasn't long ago he was wanking lyrical about Jon Flanaghan

Wasnt long ago most of us were too. Shows how far we've come as a side.

 

[rurikbird]

I still love that Flanno moment against Spurs and his subsequent failure to establish himself at the top level doesn't change that one bit. It's a testament to spiring running through this club that even a player of moderate abilities can be a hero for a day if they embrace it and ride the wave – and some like Carra can actually translate it into a top-level career.

Having said that, for building a squad capable of long-term dominance it helps to have both the "spirit" and the prodigious talent like TAA does.

 

[King Binny]

 

[Modo]

Wasnt long ago most of us were too. Shows how far we've come as a side.

Eh no.

 

[StevieM]

All of them are better atm.
Have the discussion after he retires.

I’ll look forward to you discussing Harvey Elliot in 2040.

Putting a calendar reminder in.

 

[darkstarexodus]

Eh no.

Not you of course.

 

[King Binny]