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Gerrard

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Giggs had nowhere near the same level of injuries & doesn't play in quite the same manner.

Also, I don't think anyone is saying he won't continue to play, but I certainly don't believe he'll be able to play in the manner he is now for a sustained period. I really hope I am wrong.
 
Fox said:
yeh a sensible poster - I don't even a nut like me would say sell Lucas to buy the battering ram ???

Lucas and Stevie on this form, Carroll and Luis, Agger and Skittles there is a top spine
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Phew.
 
Fox said:
yeh a sensible poster - I don't even a nut like me would say sell Lucas to buy the battering ram ???

Lucas and Stevie on this form, Carroll and Luis, Agger and Skittles there is a top spine
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The battering ram? Parker?!

Do you even watch england or just read a tabloid summary?

He'd be better described as the headless chicken. If he didn't have Gerrard in front of him we'd be massively exposed at the back. He is never in position & consistently concedes possession.
 
FoxForceFive said:
The battering ram? Parker?!

Do you even watch england or just read a tabloid summary?

He'd be better described as the headless chicken. If he didn't have Gerrard in front of him we'd be massively exposed at the back. He is never in position & consistently concedes possession.
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I don't mean battering in a positive way I mean it as he must be constantly bruised and battered as all he does is throw him self in front of the ball and people because he is so out of position, he is not great at all. To be fair to him he does care what hurts.

Not fit to lace lucas's boots
 
FoxForceFive said:
The battering ram? Parker?!

Do you even watch england or just read a tabloid summary?

He'd be better described as the headless chicken. If he didn't have Gerrard in front of him we'd be massively exposed at the back. He is never in position & consistently concedes possession.
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Not really a fan of Parker but I honestly think you go well OTT with your criticism of Parker FFF. He's certainly nothing great and I wouldn't swap him for Lucas or anything but he's a pretty adequate player. Certainly not class but his tackling isn't that bad, his commitment is unquestionable and he doesn't hide.

I'm trying to be careful not to exaggerate in order to counter balance your comments but he's well better than what you're saying IMO.
 
I respect your opinion wizardry, I usually agree with your views on football, however when I watch parker behind Gerrard I just see a player playing out of position far too often & forcing Gerrard to track back & cover for him.

I get the feeling he's trying too hard, determined to show his commitment by running everywhere, when if he sat more he'd be much more effective imo. Didi was the perfect example of how to do it without covering every blade of grass.

Perhaps I am being too harsh, I certainly don't like him, or spurs, so perhaps it's effecting my judgement. I'll try to watch it with a more impartial eye on Sunday!
 
From an international perspective, Gerrard has shown how to lead a team. Quietly confident, respectful at press conferences, playing down any hype.

Then there has been his performance on the pitch. Assured, patient, driven, dominating, creative. That other football lumninaries outside of the press see it (ie respected ex players) means he is doing the do.

Parker is not his ideal partner imo, but Parker has been putting lots of workrate, albeit not that efficient at times and that has allowed Gerrard to dictate and probe. Simply because he does not have to run around chasing every ball and making every tackle. If he had to do that, he'd be spent by now.

Gerrard's performances have been measured but his influence is growing. I've always said that the biggest mistake of England managers was to try and accommodate both Gerrard and Lampard. Gerrard's utility has been his downfall in the their eyes, hence why he has been asked to do a variety of roles. Simply because Lumpard doesn't have that versatility.

Can you imagine the French in Zidane's heyday, turning round and saying "Hey Zinedine, we got a problem at sweeper so can you play there cos you're such a good player?" Would they fuck!

Game plans are great and so are systems but some players need the freedom. That England and Liverpool have had exactly that type of player in Gerrard for the past 14 years is amazing. What's not so amazing is that England either didn't recognise it or didn't want to recognise it. Thank the Lord that successive LFC managers haven't made the same mistake.

I have watched the games in the pub so far and its been interesting to hear fans of other clubs not only applauding Gerrards worth to Liverpool but his apparent worth to England. The light has been switched. In the past I've heard him compared to Barnes by the backwater club twats, because they just think he should translate his Liverpool form to England. Its not as simple as that, you have to allow him to express himself.

One moan though. I wish he'd stop handing responsibility to the likes of Young and others for free kicks within shooting distance. How the fuck does Young get above him in the pecking order based on his performances and delivery so far? Come on Steven, this is your moment. It wont come again, go for the kill and write your name in international history for all the right reasons.

That said, if it fucks up with England, I am happy in the knowledge that this legend of a player has been ours and its been my privilege to watch him grow from that first game in 1998 as sinewy, crop-haired, teenager.

Steven Gerrard is a Liverpool legend and he doesn't need to prove for England to keep me happy - but of course if he does, then its not a bad thing!
 
He actually looks a better captain for England than he is for Liverpool. With England he's determined to see the team succeed under him, so he's supportive and positive all the time. With LFC he seems too much like a supporter - frustrated, impatient and angry, and that mood spreads like wildfire when things go wrong; he scowls, moans and snaps at other players and the confidence drains out of them. If he could bring back his attitude as captain, as well as his form, to LFC next season it would be incredibly helpful.
 
I hope there's another 5 or 6 years of this to come. The last couple of seasons have been poor, but it looks like something has clicked. There isn't a player in the world I'd rather have than a fit and in form Gerrard and it could be the making of our season.

But he'll go and do his fucking cruciate against Italy.
 
Interesting you mention Zidane there. I thought in 2006 (and to a lesser extent 2004) an aging Zidane who was clearly past his untouchable best drove a weak France team to the Final (and QF of 2004) when they were massively unfancied to get anywhere.
Obviously we know what happened in the final but en route Zidanes swansong was fantastic.
Gerrard is reminding me of that tournament for Zizou this time. If he ends up with a runner up medal for his efforts it will be a reward for his 10 or so years of selfless service with successive managers shoving him all ove the pitch. He and Ashley Cole deserve far more than England this millenium have offered them.
 
hope Stevie avoids a booking, if we beat Italy he will be banned for Semi I believe
 
gkmacca said:
He actually looks a better captain for England than he is for Liverpool. With England he's determined to see the team succeed under him, so he's supportive and positive all the time. With LFC he seems too much like a supporter - frustrated, impatient and angry, and that mood spreads like wildfire when things go wrong; he scowls, moans and snaps at other players and the confidence drains out of them. If he could bring back his attitude as captain, as well as his form, to LFC next season it would be incredibly helpful.
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Great post, you're spot on.
 
Fox said:
yeh a sensible poster - I don't even a nut like me would say sell Lucas to buy the battering ram ???

Lucas and Stevie on this form, Carroll and Luis, Agger and Skittles there is a top spine
Click to expand...

I reckon the word you're missing there is "think".

What are the friggin odds ???!
 
Despite how in form he is, If Man City came in for him or AN other club with a decent offer.. I'd sell.. If he helps England to win the Euro's, or even make the final, I can see that happening...

Despite his class he is too injury prone and we have seen the best of him..

Being the wrong side of thirty n all...

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I have to disagree with Spion a little bit in what was an excellently worded post. England have asked SG to play CM dozens of times, and asked him to be the intelligent deep lying CM and boss a game playing in tandem with Frank Lampard. Gerrard has appeared unhappy to perform this role as he was producing swash-buckling cameos for LFC in a more advanced position. I don't feel that was too much to ask from him, he could have produced this recent level of performance over 10 years and would be considered more complete and influential a player for England across the world of football. IMO he didn't want to, instead wanting to play further forward and produce performances like he does for Liverpool. This hasn't worked or fitted into the teams' style of play and hence SG has sometimes disappointed at International level.
Maybe now he knows he can't run about like an idiot trying to single handedly win games, or maybe his legs won't let him. Either way he has dictated the tempo style and influenced games like a true world class player. This is the SG we can see for us for the next 5 years and I can't wait. We just need more options further up the field now to compliment him, and reduce the number of times he feels the need to do it all himself.
 
Fuck off...

Ill start supporting another club... Lets face it, its not like we are going to win things by sellinv players who have been with the club for 20 years....

Its one thing to be a soulless club with just a singleminded aim to win stuff, and another to be a soulless average club...
 
Lochness, even in this form Gerrard needs a more mobile midfielder to play alongside him. Lampard was never that player and the partnership never worked. Id still not replace Parker with Lampard at his best....

How you can lay the blame only on Gerrard when Lampard has contributed in equal measure to the problem is a mystery...
 
jono@home said:
Despite how in form he is, If Man City came in for him or AN other club with a decent offer.. I'd sell.. If he helps England to win the Euro's, or even make the final, I can see that happening...

Despite his class he is too injury prone and we have seen the best of him..

Being the wrong side of thirty n all...

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Sorry but that's just absolute bollocks.

I'm sure that won't go down well with a number of people and some twat is going to come on and tell me how no one player is bigger than the club and all that malarky. Fact is Gerrard deserves a hell of a lot more. If he (and Cole) according to Oncy deserve a lot more than what their nation has been able to give them on the pitch then Gerrard sure as hell deserves a lot more from his club.

I agree with Oncy; I think Gerrard deserves a lot more than what England has offered him. He's been told to fill a variety of roles for England by several managers because, as Spion rightly points out, he was the only one with the class and versatility to do so. His abilities, instead of being used for the benefit of his country, have been used to his own detriment.

For England he's never really had a choice; for his club, as we're all painfully aware, he's had several choices. The fact he's stood with the club despite having all the riches and rewards of club football offered to him is something very special. He made that decision based on love and passion for the club - something we've been crying for and unsuccessfully demanding from the vast majority of our players for decades. Here's the best player we've had for at least 20 years and perhaps, arguably ever, showing that love and passion for the club in spades. Our response - get rid for a few quid so we can try and replace with some souless mercenary out of eastern Europe?

That'd be the end of football in my life for quite some time............. and the end of the real Liverpool Football Club forever.
 
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kingjulian said:
Lochness, even in this form Gerrard needs a more mobile midfielder to play alongside him. Lampard was never that player and the partnership never worked. Id still not replace Parker with Lampard at his best....

How you can lay the blame only on Gerrard when Lampard has contributed in equal measure to the problem is a mystery...
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To reply to Loch's post even further; the whole point of England managers with Gerrard and Lampard was they wanted the best of both worlds. They wanted the swashbuckling Gerrard to switch on and score goals then switch off and run the play behind Lampard..... then switch on and set up the play...... then switch off and hold the backline together. To a lesser extent this was true of Lampard as well. Both Lampard and Gerrard had excellent holding mids behind them at club level. To ask each of them to do both jobs was naive in the extreme and, for mine, that's why the blame rests largely on the managers.
 
Jono. He does that sometimes. Dont hold it against him. He just doesnt have a soul.
 
Rafa didn't trust SG to play CM, as he felt he would get caught out of position too often. I would guess this would be as he bombs on too often instead of being selective with his driving forward. He certainly trusted him defensively as he played him at RB. But not enough for his key position of CM. now SG has matured a bit, a lot actually, he picks and chooses when to push on, waiting for the right moment rather than every available moment. This is the reason he looks so comfortable at CM now, game intelligence wins over athleticism. I love it BTW, a fit SG can run a game with his eyes closed at every level without having to run around like an excited toddler.
 
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