Hugo Boss

[Frogfish]

Costing the same as Isak is the exact point. We were sensible about it and decided to use that money across other key areas, including having a “just does a job” player in Endo. I’m not advocating buying 4 fucking Endos.

Getting Guehi over the line (another £10 million in late July would see him here), a player like Jacob Ramsay (£40 mill) plus two more is not out of the question.

Your '4 players' (that money could’ve got Guehi over the line and added a DM, LW and back-up forward) means an average of £29m per player. And an extra £10m for Guehi makes it £45m for him (I don't believe that would have made any difference TBH, Glassner made sure of that) and so £25m for each of the other three. That isn't the market for top quality players (maybe not even average ones for a Top 4 team) and hasn't been for a decade.

We went for the 2nd top scorer in the PL last season, coming into his prime. That isn't ever going to be cheap and proven strikers always cost more than their actual worth because, you know, they are proven! Oh and let's be clear - Ekitike WAS the backup striker and look what we paid for him (and are not regretting).

We also went for a 'generational talent' in Wirtz. Not my words but I applaud the top brass for having the balls to go for players perceived to be the best in their position.

It is clear we intended to put a team together that will continue to win PL and CL trophies. I'd much rather we tried and failed (let's wait a couple of seasons to see if that is the case) than bought a raft of mediocrity and settled for staying in and around the Top 4.

 

[Frogfish]

You are making yourself look like a bit of a balloon head

Not my fault you failed to comprehend the debate and waded in getting it all wrong !

If it was TWO players instead of Isak there may have been a case. But likely not because there was a lack of standout and available CFs around last Summer - as everyone on here was saying. But that wasn't what Momo said - he said FOUR. That wouldn't have improved us - it would have fucked us up.

 

[Holle]

Very impressive guy. Tremendous player, modest with it and his English is every bit as good as my French.

His English is almost better than my German.

 

[Brizzle]

Not my fault you failed to comprehend the debate and waded in getting it all wrong !

If it was TWO players instead of Isak there may have been a case. But likely not because there was a lack of standout and available CFs around last Summer - as everyone on here was saying. But that wasn't what Momo said - he said FOUR. That wouldn't have improved us - it would have fucked us up.

You are starting to exaggerate to try to prove a point you are struggling to prove

 

[Frogfish]

You are starting to exaggerate to try to prove a point you are struggling to prove

Exaggeration? Not one iota. I've given you the quote and pointed you to the post we're debating - you're ignoring it. You don't seem to be on the same page as Momo and are instead debating an imaginary tangential conversation about 2 or 3, which was never the debate.

 

[MomoWASright]

Your '4 players' (that money could’ve got Guehi over the line and added a DM, LW and back-up forward) means an average of £29m per player. And an extra £10m for Guehi makes it £45m for him (I don't believe that would have made any difference TBH, Glassner made sure of that) and so £25m for each of the other three. That isn't the market for top quality players (maybe not even average ones for a Top 4 team) and hasn't been for a decade.

We went for the 2nd top scorer in the PL last season, coming into his prime. That isn't ever going to be cheap and proven strikers always cost more than their actual worth because, you know, they are proven! Oh and let's be clear - Ekitike WAS the backup striker and look what we paid for him (and are not regretting).

We also went for a 'generational talent' in Wirtz. Not my words but I applaud the top brass for having the balls to go for players perceived to be the best in their position.

It is clear we intended to put a team together that will continue to win PL and CL trophies. I'd much rather we tried and failed (let's wait a couple of seasons to see if that is the case) than bought a raft of mediocrity and settled for staying in and around the Top 4.

Glasner would never have threatened to resign had he been given a month to replace Guehi instead of 2 hours.

We were able to take advantage of release clauses for Mac. I’m 100% positive we know of more out there but decided to double down on basically the same type of player instead of looking at other areas we can see is an issue right now. Are you also saying Isak is £116 million? We’ve set aside £130 million for him.

If we bought the backup why go for the original target. One who has had one single season without injuries.

Whilst not your words, generational talent is pushing it, but like you applaud what they have tried there. Still massively overpaid in my opinion.

We aren’t making a good job of winning the premier league or champions league because we’ve been more shit than good. That could be because we didn’t use the money well and dropped the boss backup to accommodate Isak.

 

[Brizzle]

Exaggeration? Not one iota. I've given you the quote and pointed you to the post we're debating - you're ignoring it. You don't seem to be on the same page as Momo and are instead debating an imaginary tangential conversation about 2 or 3, which was never the debate.

I was originally replying to Tomas and hadn't read past his post before responding. Then I chanced upon the exact same point being argued as not possible.

I'm glad I'm not on the same page as Momo. He's a Kelly's Hero and I'm a Dirty Slot.

 

[tomasjj]

While we are discussing our signings, how about them fullbacks, where one looks to be riises lost Hungarian brother, the other one an injury prone utility player who cannot play right back.

Seriously, I have no idea what slot is doing with Kerkez, playing him in a way that negates his strengths, and amplifies his weaknesses.

 

[Frogfish]

Are you also saying Isak is £116 million? We’ve set aside £130 million for him.

Oh my bad. £116m was for Wirtz. Age related memory loss. Isak was £125m. Still just another £9m which is neither here nor there in the big picture.

 

[Frogfish]

Glasner would never have threatened to resign had he been given a month to replace Guehi instead of 2 hours.

I doubt that. It would be dependent on them finding a suitable replacement. And even one month ...

We were able to take advantage of release clauses for Mac. I’m 100% positive we know of more out there but decided to double down on basically the same type of player instead of looking at other areas we can see is an issue right now.

This assumes we are tactically going to stay the same. Whereas I think it's clear we aren't and Slot doesn't want us to. I don't see any other areas we didn't cover bar another CB. If we had found one I don't doubt the money was there and had nothing to do with Isak.

If we bought the backup why go for the original target. One who has had one single season without injuries.

Just because the backup arrived first why would we suddenly give up on the prime target (we lost two strikers - we needed to replace them). Where's the logic in that? That's like saying I want a malt loaf and a baguette. Oh I don't need the baguette now since I've just bought the malt loaf first!

Whilst not your words, generational talent is pushing it, but like you applaud what they have tried there. Still massively overpaid in my opinion.

We aren’t making a good job of winning the premier league or champions league because we’ve been more shit than good. That could be because we didn’t use the money well and dropped the boss backup to accommodate Isak.

Waaaay too early to come to any conclusions. Try the end of the season. I foresee more struggles before we see the semblence of a PL/CL winning team coming together. I'm hopeful that means the second half of the season - just in time for the CL later stages!

 

[MomoWASright]

Oh my bad. £116m was for Wirtz. Age related memory loss. Isak was £125m. Still just another £9m which is neither here nor there in the big picture.

That £9 million covers the “Endo” in my thinking.

 

[MomoWASright]

I doubt that. It would be dependent on them finding a suitable replacement. And even one month ...

This assumes we are tactically going to stay the same. Whereas I think it's clear we aren't and Slot doesn't want us to. I don't see any other areas we didn't cover bar another CB. If we had found one I don't doubt the money was there and had nothing to do with Isak.

Just because the backup arrived first why would we suddenly give up on the prime target (we lost two strikers - we needed to replace them). Where's the logic in that? That's like saying I want a malt loaf and a baguette. Oh I don't need the baguette now since I've just bought the malt loaf first!

Waaaay too early to come to any conclusions. Try the end of the season. I foresee more struggles before we see the semblence of a PL/CL winning team coming together. I'm hopeful that means the second half of the season - just in time for the CL later stages!

No way he would’ve walked. Those stories surfaced on a final day transfer. Had it been the case then we would’ve been told to jog on from day one. We found the CB we wanted but wouldn’t shift on our price. That has a lot to do with what we had put aside for Isak.

The selling point for getting Slot in was he wasn’t changing much. That has been thrown completely out of the window despite winning the league with what worked for us for the last seven seasons. If changing is the long term strategy then renewing Salah is nonsensical. Like I said in the SOS thread, if we are half heartedly going for transformation for next season’s tactics then it’s stupid. We risk being top 4, get players to play one way this season to change it next season whilst battering the confidence of all the players. Saying that, we aren’t even evolving. We started the season with the same 4-3-3 with players who can’t do it.

Your analogy doesn’t work because those are different things. It’s like going the shops to buy a chicken for your roast. You get in the ASDA but they don’t have free range corn fed extra large, just free range extra large so you pick it up. On the way home you think shit, I need something else and pop into M&S food and there is the chicken you wanted. You don’t buy that as well.

It’s not jumping to conclusions. We’ve lost three premier league games and one champions league game. Last season it was 4 and 2 respectively. It’s still October. We have seen a 4 point lead flipped to 4 points behind and now chasing a side who have conceded one goal in eight. All because we had to squeeze in Isak into the side.

 

[tomasjj]

That has a lot to do with what we had put aside for Isak

You are just speculating.

 

[MomoWASright]

You are just speculating.

If Isak was 100% a no go like Newcastle said would we have thought twice about upping our bid?

 

[Frogfish]

No way he would’ve walked. Those stories surfaced on a final day transfer. Had it been the case then we would’ve been told to jog on from day one. We found the CB we wanted but wouldn’t shift on our price. That has a lot to do with what we had put aside for Isak.

The selling point for getting Slot in was he wasn’t changing much. That has been thrown completely out of the window despite winning the league with what worked for us for the last seven seasons.

We lost 3 and drew 2 of the last 8 games. TAA was leaving. Robbo was falling off a cliff. Nunez was leaving having not worked out. Then Diaz went. We weren't staying with Klopp-ball no matter what anyone said.

If changing is the long term strategy then renewing Salah is nonsensical. Like I said in the SOS thread, if we are half heartedly going for transformation for next season’s tactics then it’s stupid. We risk being top 4, get players to play one way this season to change it next season whilst battering the confidence of all the players. Saying that, we aren’t even evolving. We started the season with the same 4-3-3 with players who can’t do it.

Evolution not revolution. And as you say yourself - it was working to an extent when we were 4 pts clear. Winning even if not razing the opposisition. In the last game we didn't play 4-3-3 it was 4-4-2 out of possession and 3-5-2 transitioning to 3-2-5 in possession. Was that a sign of the future ? We may see vs Brentford however with Isak out maybe not.

Your analogy doesn’t work because those are different things.

Nah both breads. But for the analogy to work they don't even have to be the same. Could be eggs and milk. You still don't drop one because you got the other.

It’s not jumping to conclusions. We’ve lost three premier league games and one champions league game. Last season it was 4 and 2 respectively. It’s still October. We have seen a 4 point lead flipped to 4 points behind and now chasing a side who have conceded one goal in eight. All because we had to squeeze in Isak into the side.

Stop comparing this season's start to last! What is the point of that - last season we had exactly the same squad as the season before, we weren't in transition. This season even a blind man can see we have to integrate new players and are undergoing a change in formation/style. We have a great squad - give it time to gel and adapt. The lack of patience in some sectors of the fanbase is astounding. If there's no improvement by the end of the season I'll be right alongside you - now however is waaaay too early.

 

[tomasjj]

If Isak was 100% a no go like Newcastle said would we have thought twice about upping our bid?

I refer to your link of Guehi to Isak.

 

[MomoWASright]

I refer to your link of Guehi to Isak.

I’ll rephrase what I was trying to ask. If we believed Newcastle were not going to sell Isak matter what, would we have used some of that £130 million we had set aside for Isak to up the bid for Guehi? You bet your bottom dollar we would’ve.

 

[tomasjj]

I’ll rephrase what I was trying to ask. If we believed Newcastle were not going to sell Mo matter what, would we have used some of that £130 million we had set aside for Isak to up the bid for Guehi? You bet your bottom dollar we would’ve.

This is where you are speculating.
For all we know the bid was accepted and Glasner stopped the deal.

 

[tomasjj]

Not only are you constantly dissing Isak, you are now even blaming him for not getting Guehi.
I just don’t get the point of this.

 

[MomoWASright]

We lost 3 and drew 2 of the last 8 games. TAA was leaving. Robbo was falling off a cliff. Nunez was leaving having not worked out. Then Diaz went. We weren't staying with Klopp-ball no matter what anyone said.

Evolution not revolution. And as you say yourself - it was working to an extent when we were 4 pts clear. Winning even if not razing the opposisition. In the last game we didn't play 4-3-3 it was 4-4-2 out of possession and 3-5-2 transitioning to 3-2-5 in possession. Was that a sign of the future ? We may see vs Brentford however with Isak out maybe not.


Nah both breads. But for the analogy to work they don't even have to be the same. Could be eggs and milk. You still don't drop one because you got the other.

Stop comparing this season's start to last! What is the point of that - last season we had exactly the same squad as the season before, we weren't in transition. This season even a blind man can see we have to integrate new players and are undergoing a change in formation/style. We have a great squad - give it time to gel and adapt. The lack of patience in some sectors of the fanbase is astounding. If there's no improvement by the end of the season I'll be right alongside you - now however is waaaay too early.

We are ripping up a system that worked for a lot of players that are still here that won the league. We’ve ripped up a system that won the lot.

If it is revolution then why didn’t we do that shit preseason or the start of this season? It makes no sense to say we will go all this fluid blah blah blah and not implement it from day one. What happened was we tried to carry on, realised we shit the bed with who we bought and now chasing our tails.

Your breads are fuck all alike. It’s comparing a fiat 500 to a Porsche. Mine works because Ekitike and Isak are so similar. Both that tall pacey forward, comes from the left and loves running into space. Your analogy is comparing Owen to Heskey. We needed different types of forwards to unlock different teams.

We can’t stop comparing to last season considering we have lost the league by a single point twice over the last decade breaking 90 points in the process. Every single point matters right now. The easiest way to integrate players is buying those who fit the system. We didn’t. We are paying the price for people trying to be overly smart.

 

[MomoWASright]

This is where you are speculating.
For all we know the bid was accepted and Glasner stopped the deal.

On deadline day. Go in earlier in the transfer window with the right bid we get him.

Not only are you constantly dissing Isak, you are now even blaming him for not getting Guehi.
I just don’t get the point of this.

I’m not blaming Isak for that. I’m blaming the club for buying Isak when we should’ve walked away from all that drama and looked across the squad.

 

[got red on me]

I’ll rephrase what I was trying to ask. If we believed Newcastle were not going to sell Mo matter what

 

[MomoWASright]

Thanks for the heads up