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The curious case of the RB who thought he was a CM

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Dreambeliever

Will he believe again?
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Trent Alexander Arnold:

“My specific skill set and what I’m best at is someone who plays in the middle, someone who controls the game, controls the tempo, creates, breaks line, progresses the ball up the pitch,” said.

“You probably get more out of me from being in the middle and I’m able to show off that skill set as much as possible. My role is to go and create and make things happen, control the game in the middle of the pitch, get the ball on to the attackers, play forward, run forward, goals, assists, create chances, get people off their seats."
 
No but we had about 393 which were converted into Trent threads.

He has the freedom to say what he feels, no issue. But in the current system we play and the players we have he hasn't shown more in goals/assists/chances/running forward and everything else he speaks of than when he was playing at RB. His switching of play which he's been widely known for has slowly dissipated too mainly because we've limited ourselves to doing so now that Robbo tends to stay in a back 3. The only +ve for me that's come with him playing inside is he's not getting rinsed 5 times a game by virtually every left winger in the league.
 
Trent Alexander Arnold:

“My specific skill set and what I’m best at is someone who plays in the middle, someone who controls the game, controls the tempo, creates, breaks line, progresses the ball up the pitch,” said.

“You probably get more out of me from being in the middle and I’m able to show off that skill set as much as possible. My role is to go and create and make things happen, control the game in the middle of the pitch, get the ball on to the attackers, play forward, run forward, goals, assists, create chances, get people off their seats."
The curious case of the CM who was converted to a RB who wanted to be a CM

Or if you want to go further back.

The curious case of the ST who was converted to a RW who was converted to a CM who was converted to a RB who wanted to be a CM

What a shit non thread.

Next.
 
Nobody wants to play rb. Not even one of the best ever. He will have to leave, surely.
That’s the crux of this latest quote and why I think it’s worthy of discussion with its own thread.
He’s basically saying I’m too good to pley right back and waste my time defending.
 
That’s the crux of this latest quote and why I think it’s worthy of discussion with its own thread.
He’s basically saying I’m too good to pley right back and waste my time defending.
Watching him play in midfield at the moment for England all I see is a boy thats completely lost.
 
From what I've seen of this England game, if he's not attempting his 50 yard pingers forward or crossfield he really isn't doing much and today he actually had Trippier starting alongside him so there was no tracking back in the RB position today.

Against Malta there is no defensive display to be had really other than just mopping up, so it's 100mins of basically, have the ball as often as you like and do as you please....that hasn't really come off for him today.

Since we are gonna persist with him I'd much sooner rather see him revert back to RB, or a wingback.
 
He did look a bit better after Rice came on. Would have gotten an assist on the disallowed goal. First half alongside Henderson and Gallagher was pointless.

Overall you have to say he doesn’t look a natural midfielder, i.e. someone who instantly knows what to do regardless of system or game situation. Trent in midfield needs a specific plan tailored to his strengths and weaknesses and with Southgate he isn’t getting one.
 
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Didn’t he also have a shot late on saved by the keeper?
Compared fo Englands other midfielder performances apart from Jude, it was fine. But playing 2 games against Malta is unlikely to have any impact on Klopp playing him there for Liverpool.
 
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Yeah I heard that he did OK. I imagine he'd be even better with Rice and Bellingham on the pitch.
 
Jonathan Liew recons Trent showed enough to earn another chance in CM:
[article]
Alexander-Arnold proves he can take centre stage for Southgate’s England
It was only Malta, but Liverpool’s gifted performer has earned a chance in central midfield against stiffer opposition.
2908.jpg

[…]
Yet as England grafted and sweated their way to another joyless three points at Wembley, ending the game with a far stronger team than Gareth Southgate would have wanted to put out, there was one redeeming feature to an otherwise desultory evening. The thwarted attacking patterns and frequent brushes with embarrassment will be largely forgotten to history. This is not a drill. Trent Alexander-Arnold may just be ready to play central midfield for England.

Yes, it was only Malta. But on a night when so many of teammates tried to make their case for a place in the Euro 2024 squad only to slip down the pecking order – Fikayo Tomori, Conor Gallagher, Marcus Rashford – Southgate’s most daring gambit was his one resounding success. At the very least there was enough in those luxuriant long balls and stylish one-touch layoffs to give him another look against stronger opposition.

Really this is the essential appeal of Alexander-Arnold, for all his well documented gifts and flaws as a player. You really want to give him the ball. You want to see what he does with it.

For a nation raised on the hard rations of Declan Rice and Jordan Henderson playing simple 10-yard passes with the instep, this is perhaps the most important point of difference that Alexander-Arnold offers: a shift in tone and texture, a vision of what an England midfield might look like with a little panache, ambition and risk.

The last of these is perhaps the vital point. Alexander-Arnold is not the guy you pick if you want endless holding patterns and immaculate, error-free control of the game. The persistent doubts over his ability to cover space and track a man out of possession have followed him from right-back to central midfield. He will occasionally lose the ball, even if he rarely did so at Wembley last night. This is simply the nature of trying things.

In this respect Alexander-Arnold is a very modern midfielder, in that his first instinct is to get the ball out of midfield as quickly as possible. His first touch is invariably an attempt to shift the ball out of his feet, and in those few split seconds the computer is already calculating. Where are the gaps going to open up? Who’s making the run? What is the move the opposition least expects at this point in time?

The sumptuous distribution we already knew about, and with a little more luck Alexander-Arnold might have had two assists. There was the short release to Rice that was chalked off by the video assistant referee. And earlier a staggering diagonal ball over the top that Rashford somehow contrived to fumble.

But all evening Alexander-Arnold was doing strange things, the sort of things that England defensive midfielders aren’t really supposed to do. Running with the ball. Little flicks and nudges out of trouble. Swerving banana passes out wide with the outside of the foot.

But in a sense the most telling moments of Alexander-Arnold’s evening were the ones in which he was not really involved at all. Early in the game there was a surging diagonal run into the right channel that Kieran Trippier spotted too late. Later, he pointed into the midfield space from which he wanted to launch a counterattack, only for Jordan Pickford to roll the ball elsewhere.

Really there is something vaguely ridiculous about this entire debate. Here is one of the most gifted technical footballers English football has produced in the past couple of decades, in superb form at one of the world’s best clubs, and still essentially on the outside looking in. But with Jude Bellingham now locked into the advanced playmaker role, Kalvin Phillips still short of minutes, and Jordan Henderson plying his trade in a novelty league, there is finally a sense of genuine jeopardy. Alexander-Arnold is ready for England. The real question is whether England are ready for him.
[/article]

 
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Jonathan Liew recons Trent showed enough to earn another chance in CM:
[article]
Alexander-Arnold proves he can take centre stage for Southgate’s England
It was only Malta, but Liverpool’s gifted performer has earned a chance in central midfield against stiffer opposition.
2908.jpg

[…]
Yet as England grafted and sweated their way to another joyless three points at Wembley, ending the game with a far stronger team than Gareth Southgate would have wanted to put out, there was one redeeming feature to an otherwise desultory evening. The thwarted attacking patterns and frequent brushes with embarrassment will be largely forgotten to history. This is not a drill. Trent Alexander-Arnold may just be ready to play central midfield for England.

Yes, it was only Malta. But on a night when so many of teammates tried to make their case for a place in the Euro 2024 squad only to slip down the pecking order – Fikayo Tomori, Conor Gallagher, Marcus Rashford – Southgate’s most daring gambit was his one resounding success. At the very least there was enough in those luxuriant long balls and stylish one-touch layoffs to give him another look against stronger opposition.

Really this is the essential appeal of Alexander-Arnold, for all his well documented gifts and flaws as a player. You really want to give him the ball. You want to see what he does with it.

For a nation raised on the hard rations of Declan Rice and Jordan Henderson playing simple 10-yard passes with the instep, this is perhaps the most important point of difference that Alexander-Arnold offers: a shift in tone and texture, a vision of what an England midfield might look like with a little panache, ambition and risk.

The last of these is perhaps the vital point. Alexander-Arnold is not the guy you pick if you want endless holding patterns and immaculate, error-free control of the game. The persistent doubts over his ability to cover space and track a man out of possession have followed him from right-back to central midfield. He will occasionally lose the ball, even if he rarely did so at Wembley last night. This is simply the nature of trying things.

In this respect Alexander-Arnold is a very modern midfielder, in that his first instinct is to get the ball out of midfield as quickly as possible. His first touch is invariably an attempt to shift the ball out of his feet, and in those few split seconds the computer is already calculating. Where are the gaps going to open up? Who’s making the run? What is the move the opposition least expects at this point in time?

The sumptuous distribution we already knew about, and with a little more luck Alexander-Arnold might have had two assists. There was the short release to Rice that was chalked off by the video assistant referee. And earlier a staggering diagonal ball over the top that Rashford somehow contrived to fumble.

But all evening Alexander-Arnold was doing strange things, the sort of things that England defensive midfielders aren’t really supposed to do. Running with the ball. Little flicks and nudges out of trouble. Swerving banana passes out wide with the outside of the foot.

But in a sense the most telling moments of Alexander-Arnold’s evening were the ones in which he was not really involved at all. Early in the game there was a surging diagonal run into the right channel that Kieran Trippier spotted too late. Later, he pointed into the midfield space from which he wanted to launch a counterattack, only for Jordan Pickford to roll the ball elsewhere.

Really there is something vaguely ridiculous about this entire debate. Here is one of the most gifted technical footballers English football has produced in the past couple of decades, in superb form at one of the world’s best clubs, and still essentially on the outside looking in. But with Jude Bellingham now locked into the advanced playmaker role, Kalvin Phillips still short of minutes, and Jordan Henderson plying his trade in a novelty league, there is finally a sense of genuine jeopardy. Alexander-Arnold is ready for England. The real question is whether England are ready for him.
[/article]



Like a bit of Liew, he is good.
 
So happy Trent's enjoying his football in a position which he won't get a domestic football. I'm sure this constant praise for him in the media while criticisms at RB won't impact us at all
 
It's not too late to convert Trent into a midfielder. He'll have to do some more defending and tracking back though, it's going to take time.
Also, Klopp needs to go and get a top class RB.
 
Yeah, the media praising Trent in midfield will surely be to much for Klopp to handle.
The England games were Trent has played in midfield:
Malta x 2, North Macedonia and Andorra.

Fantastic evidence that he has to play in midfield from now on.
 
It's not too late to convert Trent into a midfielder. He'll have to do some more defending and tracking back though, it's going to take time.
Also, Klopp needs to go and get a top class RB.

You mean he can't lose his concentration and let someone run right by him into the six yard box? Off the ball he's a calamity as a deep lying playmaker. That's what we call a DM who has the ability to play a pass but zero of the more relevant characteristics for the role, right?
 
It's not too late to convert Trent into a midfielder. He'll have to do some more defending and tracking back though, it's going to take time.
Also, Klopp needs to go and get a top class RB.

I think part of the idea of playing him in midfield as a DLP is that he doesn’t have to track back so much because he is stationed deeper (and more centrally of course) than an attacking RB. Our big vulnerability with him at RB was the space on the wing he left behind and wasn’t willing to track back into. As a Pirlo-like CM, if paired with someone like Rice, he can focus more on interceptions and turning defense into attack, which is his strength, and not have to be as positionally disciplined, which is what he always struggled with.
 
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I think part of the idea of playing him in midfield as a DLP is that he doesn’t have to track back so much because he is stationed deeper (and more central, obviously) than an attacking RB. Our big vulnerability with him at RB was the space on the wing he left behind and wasn’t willing to track back into. As a Pirlo-like CM, if paired with someone like Rice, he can focus more on interceptions and turning defense into attack, which is his strength, and not have to be as positionally disciplined, which is what he always struggled with.

I think you could potentially see Trent move to midfield in the latter stages of his career, and most likely in post Klopp Liverpool era.
Before then its not gonna happen. Although based on the amazing evidence from the quality of the England games that a few of our fans use. It could happen if we get relegated to League Two.
 
Klopp doesn’t play with 3 CBs, but I think Trent’s ideal position is a free-roaming RWB, allowed to cut inside or join the midfield while someone like Bajcetic is holding the fort at RCB and filling in the gaps he is leaving. When we were linked with a bunch of left-footed CBs in the summer, it seemed that was what Klopp had in mind, but then Tsimikas had the contract extended and Klopp obviously decided to find a hybrid system that would both accommodate Trent and a 4-at-the-back formation. It’s working to an extent, but some problems remained unresolved.
 
Yeah, the media praising Trent in midfield will surely be to much for Klopp to handle.
The England games were Trent has played in midfield:
Malta x 2, North Macedonia and Andorra.

Fantastic evidence that he has to play in midfield from now on.
I don't think it'll be too much for klopp to handle. Klopp will ignore it.

My issue is it's inflating his ego on an international scale, while once again he highlights the focus he belongs in mid.

He doesn't. He belongs at RB for us.

Klopp and him will probably have a collision at some point, more than likely around contract renewal
 
I don't think it'll be too much for klopp to handle. Klopp will ignore it.

My issue is it's inflating his ego on an international scale, while once again he highlights the focus he belongs in mid.

He doesn't. He belongs at RB for us.

Klopp and him will probably have a collision at some point, more than likely around contract renewal

I think you didnt get the sarcasm in my post re Klopp.
Trent will sign a new deal without any fuss about playing position. Guaranteed.
 
Klopp doesn’t play with 3 CBs, but I think Trent’s ideal position is a free-roaming RWB, allowed to cut inside or join the midfield while someone like Bajcetic is holding the fort at RCB and filling in the gaps he is leaving. When we were linked with a bunch of left-footed CBs in the summer, it seemed that was what Klopp had in mind, but then Tsimikas had the contract extended and Klopp obviously decided to find a hybrid system that would both accommodate Trent and a 4-at-the-back formation. It’s working to an extent, but some problems remained unresolved.

Can see Klopp continuing to try Bajcetic in the Trent role to continue his development.
 
You mean he can't lose his concentration and let someone run right by him into the six yard box? Off the ball he's a calamity as a deep lying playmaker. That's what we call a DM who has the ability to play a pass but zero of the more relevant characteristics for the role, right?
I'm not talking about playing him as a DM, I'm thinking the Hendo role on the right. We can benefit from his passes and crosses.
 
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