studge moaning
- Thread starter redhorizon2
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Didn't Gerrard moan when he was shunted out to the right? Had his, arguably, best season there as well
You'd think the perma-crocked twat would be happy to be playing. At the very least he could put together a decent run of games before moaning to the papers. Then go back to doing what he does best i.e. stealing a living.
I don't see an issue with what he has said and I'm far from his biggest fan.
Wow, he's moaning all right. Somehow I have a feeling he'll be on the bench in the next game.
It's not like Klopp is playing him really on the wing – his position in Klopp's system is more central than the one under Rodgers during the 2013-14 season when Rodgers was alternating between playing Suarez and Sturridge as the centre-forward. Around February-March the coach settled on the 4-4-2 "diamond" as the main system, but until then there were games when either Sturridge or Suarez played like real wingers – in particular I remember the game vs Arsenal away when Suarez was forced to defend so deep that he almost played as a left-back (and did great BTW without any moaning). In Rodgers' 4-3-3 wingers generally play close to the touch line in order to keep the pitch as wide as possible, but with freedom to cut inside. By contrast, Klopp's 4-3-3 is designed to keep all 3 attacking players as centrally as possible, because Klopp is big on the idea that attackers must be inside the penalty area to score.
The problem with playing Sturridge as CF is that he is, frankly, terrible at holding up the ball and 50/50 duels (they become more like 90/10 duels in his case). So from a defensive standpoint it becomes like not playing with a CF at all – any long ball upfield just gifts possession back to the other team. Not all managers prefer to play with "target man" type CFs (or a versatile forward with at least some target man abilities), but most of the top ones – Klopp, Wenger, Mourinho, Rafa, Conte, Simeone – generally do, most of the time. Even Guardiola, who has popularized the whole "false nine" idea has come to appreciate what a player like Lewandowski (probably the best hold-up CF in world football today) can do for him. So bad luck for Sturridge – he simply doesn't have a tool in his tool-kit that most managers nowadays consider necessary for a centre-forward. Instead of moaning in the press about not being played at CF he should have a conversation with Klopp about how he can be more effective playing on the right of a forward 3, perhaps exchanging positions with Origi during the long spells of possession – I'm sure Klopp would be open to try various things to accommodate his most talented finisher. But going to the press before having a talk with the coach is a bad idea that will probably backfire.
It's not like Klopp is playing him really on the wing – his position in Klopp's system is more central than the one under Rodgers during the 2013-14 season when Rodgers was alternating between playing Suarez and Sturridge as the centre-forward. Around February-March the coach settled on the 4-4-2 "diamond" as the main system, but until then there were games when either Sturridge or Suarez played like real wingers – in particular I remember the game vs Arsenal away when Suarez was forced to defend so deep that he almost played as a left-back (and did great BTW without any moaning). In Rodgers' 4-3-3 wingers generally play close to the touch line in order to keep the pitch as wide as possible, but with freedom to cut inside. By contrast, Klopp's 4-3-3 is designed to keep all 3 attacking players as centrally as possible, because Klopp is big on the idea that attackers must be inside the penalty area to score.
The problem with playing Sturridge as CF is that he is, frankly, terrible at holding up the ball and 50/50 duels (they become more like 90/10 duels in his case). So from a defensive standpoint it becomes like not playing with a CF at all – any long ball upfield just gifts possession back to the other team. Not all managers prefer to play with "target man" type CFs (or a versatile forward with at least some target man abilities), but most of the top ones – Klopp, Wenger, Mourinho, Rafa, Conte, Simeone – generally do, most of the time. Even Guardiola, who has popularized the whole "false nine" idea has come to appreciate what a player like Lewandowski (probably the best hold-up CF in world football today) can do for him. So bad luck for Sturridge – he simply doesn't have a tool in his tool-kit that most managers nowadays consider necessary for a centre-forward. Instead of moaning in the press about not being played at CF he should have a conversation with Klopp about how he can be more effective playing on the right of a forward 3, perhaps exchanging positions with Origi during the long spells of possession – I'm sure Klopp would be open to try various things to accommodate his most talented finisher. But going to the press before having a talk with the coach is a bad idea that will probably backfire.
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Don't you get it ? Milner is white, Sturridge is black; Milner has every right to express himself.
There is a subtle, but significant difference in emphasis between Milner's and Sturridge's statements. Basically Milner said it's not his favorite position, but he's happy to play anywhere if the team needs him, end of story. Sturridge is saying he will play, but that doesn't mean he is happy about the situation, then went on to describe at length why he thinks the position of a wing-forward is unsuitable for him and then admitted that he did not have a conversation with Klopp about it (unlike Milner who did).
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Last thing we need is to bring race into it.
I'll never warm to him because of his shitty attitude. Incredibly talented but a right big headed prat.
When Suarez was scoring I always got the feeling that he was jealous and put out. I imagine he was happy to see the back of Suarez as it made him the star player, regardless of how it impacted on our success.
Now is the time for him to knuckle down and earn his spot in the team. Its obvious that he thinks he's the best player and doesn't need to put in the same amount of work, his brilliance is a gift from god and things simply revolve around him.
I genuinely believe that he would be happier getting man of the match in a game we've lost than to play and have little impact in a crucial win.
I wouldn't be upset if we sold him. I hate watching fuckers not play for the shirt.
When Suarez was scoring I always got the feeling that he was jealous and put out. I imagine he was happy to see the back of Suarez as it made him the star player, regardless of how it impacted on our success.
Now is the time for him to knuckle down and earn his spot in the team. Its obvious that he thinks he's the best player and doesn't need to put in the same amount of work, his brilliance is a gift from god and things simply revolve around him.
I genuinely believe that he would be happier getting man of the match in a game we've lost than to play and have little impact in a crucial win.
I wouldn't be upset if we sold him. I hate watching fuckers not play for the shirt.
I understand and agree with all that
I hope he gets his shit together, but I think it's too late for him (mentality wise)
This.
There's enough time to get the deal done.
This is how he started agitating at City and Chelsea aswell.
He thinks hes entitled to play when he is fit no matter what. He cant be relied on.
I fucking love him, always have, but a big bid and i'd sell.
Bring in Lacazette or someone else who is good.
He thinks hes entitled to play when he is fit no matter what. He cant be relied on.
I fucking love him, always have, but a big bid and i'd sell.
Bring in Lacazette or someone else who is good.
Great post. He's being silly. I didn't even notice he WAS playing on the wing, given that he seemed to be doing what he always does, regardless of instructions, and drifting wherever he fancied. That's more the problem with Studge: he drifts, and drifts pretty effectively most of the time, but that role does rely on the other attacking players working hard to accommodate his movement.
Ditto. Love lacazette here, I've been raving about him for years. Unbelievable he hasn't moved on yet
He is entirely correct to be annoyed at playing wide, when he is the best striker at the club, and one of the best in the league. Especially when he had to watch Firmino play centrally.
But making his annoyance public isn't great.
Benteke has already gone and not been replaced, so Klopp would have to be fucking mental to allow Sturridge to leave without having a top quality striker ready to come in. I worry about who that would be and if he would be good enough; Klopp has bought plenty of average players.
And Sturridge at his best is an amazingly gifted striker, exponentially superior in every way to anyone else at the club.
At his best. I'm not going to bang on about his injuries - well documented - or supposed attitude - largely subjective - but it is worth noting that over the last 12 months or so there is some legitimate concerns about his pace.
Has he lost it? Is it fitness? Because if that speed and acceleration has gone, just sell him now. The team is slow enough as it is, with only the recently arrived Mane offering any of the speed that all great teams have. If Sturridge is no longer capable of beating defenders in a foot race, just get rid.
But making his annoyance public isn't great.
Benteke has already gone and not been replaced, so Klopp would have to be fucking mental to allow Sturridge to leave without having a top quality striker ready to come in. I worry about who that would be and if he would be good enough; Klopp has bought plenty of average players.
And Sturridge at his best is an amazingly gifted striker, exponentially superior in every way to anyone else at the club.
At his best. I'm not going to bang on about his injuries - well documented - or supposed attitude - largely subjective - but it is worth noting that over the last 12 months or so there is some legitimate concerns about his pace.
Has he lost it? Is it fitness? Because if that speed and acceleration has gone, just sell him now. The team is slow enough as it is, with only the recently arrived Mane offering any of the speed that all great teams have. If Sturridge is no longer capable of beating defenders in a foot race, just get rid.
The difference being that Milner will go out on the pitch, give 110% and will more than likely do a good job regardless of how unhappy he is in the role. Sturridge just looks half arsed at the best of times, unless it's going well for him.
Was he that reliant on speed to score his goals? He's scored all kinds of goals for us - tap ins, headers, long shots, speculative shots.
He did, but that initial burst of acceleration was what gave him the space. Or coming from deep. Or ironically, wide
If you could find someone who'd never seen Sturridge play and had no knowledge of him at all, and sit him down to watch a typical Sturridge performance, I'm not sure, if you then asked the person to say what position Studge played, they'd say 'centre forward'. They'd say he was really good, but I suspect they'd struggle to pin down exactly where he was supposed to play. That's not a criticism, far from it, but he's not a centre forward in the same sense that, say, Shearer was a centre forward. Sturridge is a defender's nightmare because one minute he's in the centre, the next he's wide out left, the next he's dropped into midfield, the next he's back in the centre, the next he's wide out right, etc etc. He'll do that whether he's officially starting in the centre forward position or any other position. So I don't think he's got that much to be angry about, three games into the season. I bet he'll keep his mouth shut no matter where he plays for England.
Hodgson did put him out wide, in the euros.
and most people on her lambasted that decision. but not JK
Most managers he's played for have put him out wide.
I don't really see it as moaning tbh. And he is right, he is best played down the middle. But...he needs to show we can rely on him so why not put 6 months of straight fitness and goals together first.
With Klopp I thought we'd see everyone in their natural positions tbh. Especially after he was so heavily critical of Ferguson and Rodgers playing Kagawa and Şahin out of position and not getting the best out of them while he was Dortmund manager.
With Klopp I thought we'd see everyone in their natural positions tbh. Especially after he was so heavily critical of Ferguson and Rodgers playing Kagawa and Şahin out of position and not getting the best out of them while he was Dortmund manager.
It's no wonder, really, that him and Firmino don't seem to be able to build up an understanding, because they're both pretty much trying to play the same role. I wonder whether managers are sticking him out wide because it's the only way of ensuring he doesn't drift all over the pitch.
Gerrard used to moan that his best position was centre midfield, then when he played there he wandered all over the pitch. As usual. And brilliant he was, too. Some players get bewitched by the idea of a position, when, if only they looked at how they actually played and how prodigious their gifts are, they'd stop being obsessed with where they are on the initial formation sheet and just play their normal game.
Obviously it's more of an issue if a manager moves a player and gives them such elaborate instructions they feel straitjacketed in game after game, but Sturridge, I repeat, is clearly still being given so much freedom he's probably one of the few people in the ground who is aware he's being played on the wing. He's not out there to be overlapped by either wing back. He's not out there putting in crosses. He's not out there tracking back down the line. Most of the time he's drifting in and around the box. As usual. This is the most unnecessary strop since Michael Jackson sulked when not enough media outlets addressed him as 'The King of Pop'. Just get on with it!
Obviously it's more of an issue if a manager moves a player and gives them such elaborate instructions they feel straitjacketed in game after game, but Sturridge, I repeat, is clearly still being given so much freedom he's probably one of the few people in the ground who is aware he's being played on the wing. He's not out there to be overlapped by either wing back. He's not out there putting in crosses. He's not out there tracking back down the line. Most of the time he's drifting in and around the box. As usual. This is the most unnecessary strop since Michael Jackson sulked when not enough media outlets addressed him as 'The King of Pop'. Just get on with it!
Klopps response to questions about it:
"First of all, you have to think a little bit about why you ask things like this," he told journalists.
"We need to find a formation where players can start. I don't want to play Daniel as a wide player, but he can play there.
"But winger is not a fixed position, especially not in Daniel's case. It's not like you play there and say wait until something happens. It's flexible football.
"In the key moments he needs to be in the finishing position. We still have to work on a lot of things. I don't know exactly what he said, but we have talks.
"I know him and there is no issue. Daniel is a smart player"
"First of all, you have to think a little bit about why you ask things like this," he told journalists.
"We need to find a formation where players can start. I don't want to play Daniel as a wide player, but he can play there.
"But winger is not a fixed position, especially not in Daniel's case. It's not like you play there and say wait until something happens. It's flexible football.
"In the key moments he needs to be in the finishing position. We still have to work on a lot of things. I don't know exactly what he said, but we have talks.
"I know him and there is no issue. Daniel is a smart player"
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