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Houllier interview, parts 1 and 2

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gkmacca

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You can take the man out of Liverpool. But you can never take Liverpool out of the manager.
Certainly not in the case of Gerard Houllier.

The former Reds boss, now 72, spent six years in charge at Anfield.

Despite making a huge impact at international level in France and presiding over league wins with both PSG and Lyon, there is a palpable sense Liverpool will always be his club.
Perhaps even his adopted home, too.

Houllier watches his old team now purely as "a fan, a supporter", without the critical eye that looked on from the dugout between 1998 and 2004.

Yet an enduring connection to Merseyside will forever remain.

Houllier explains: "It is special. In Liverpool you've got to be ready to give a lot of effort for what you do. To be totally committed.

"And once you have been in Liverpool, you feel something special about the club. About the people. About the fans."


The crowning glory of Houllier's tenure was the famous treble season, which saw the Reds land three cups amid a remarkable run of trophy gathering in 2001.

The League Cup was lifted in February after a shootout victory against Birmingham City. A Michael Owen-inspired turnaround secured the FA Cup in May with a 2-1 win over Arsenal. And just four days later, Alaves were vanquished in a wild 5-4 clash to claim the UEFA Cup

Does Houllier consider 2000/01 to be his finest campaign in management? "Yeah," he admits. "But we would have liked to win the title on top of that!

"We finished third that year and second the following season. Liverpool's DNA is about silverware. About winning things. Winning the League Cup [in 2001] gave confidence to get to the other finals.

"Winning the UEFA Cup was huge because it was a long time since Liverpool had won a cup in Europe. That was important. You could see the pride of the people in the street.

The team, the club, the people, the players, the staff...we put Liverpool back on the European map. That's what it meant."

Houllier was keenly aware of the rich history he was tasked with preserving and progressing at Liverpool. And from the outset, he knew he held a unique place in it.

Reflecting on his Anfield arrival, the Frenchman says: "I was following the boot room tradition.
"Bill Shankly, then when Shankly goes Bob Paisley. Paisley goes, Joe Fagan. Fagan to Kenny Dalglish. Graeme Souness and after him Roy Evans.

"Me coming in was special because it was the first foreign coach. After that you had Rafa Benitez and now Jurgen Klopp."

While 2001 was to be the high point of his spell as the league proved elusive, Houllier oversaw changes off the pitch that propelled Liverpool into the modern era.

And that process rightly figures almost as significantly as trophy count when he assesses his reign.

Houllier says: "When you're a manager you need three things. You need to have results, you need to leave a legacy, and also you need to make players and the team improve.

"When I left there was a team in the Champions League spots. There was a different habit and a different tradition of preparing the team and approaching competitions.

"In terms of diet and looking after ourselves, we changed things which helped to be more competitive. There were new facilities with the new Melwood.

"Michael Owen won the Ballon d'Or. Players like Jamie Carragher, Danny Murphy, Robbie Fowler, Emile Heskey...they all improved when we were together there.

"And of course Steven Gerrard. I saw him when he was 17-and-a-half. He started training and playing with the first team. He became captain at the age of 23. That tells you everything."

Plenty of ex-Reds stars still speak of Houllier with glowing reverence. His teacher-like, almost paternal presence clearly left a mark on numerous careers.

How did he approach his relationship with the squad? He says: "Players need somebody who knows where he is going and what he wants to do. They follow somebody who has a vision.

"And they need 'tough love'. You've got to be tough sometimes but you've got to love them. They need to understand that they can rely on you in case of a problem.

"But you love them. Jurgen is a good demonstration of that as well."


Many fans point to the summer of 2002 - when El Hadji Diouf, Salif Diao and Bruno Cheyrou were signed - as a crucial juncture when Liverpool struggled to kick on and bolster their success.

But for Houllier there is another much more personal 'what if?' moment that defined his later years with the club.

When asked if he would change anything about his time at Anfield, he replies: "If I could have avoided the heart problem that I had, yes.

"Maybe you have some regrets - you think you might have signed such-and-such a player. But in the end we did well.

"In five years we won six trophies which is not too bad.

"Maybe I was a good turning point in the history of the club. I came at the right time, as [former chairman] Mr David Moores said, to 'bring the club into the 21st century'. In terms of attitude, habits, and the way of training and developing players.

"The people at Liverpool are special. They give you time to do things. We needed to change some things and they backed me to do it."


When Houllier suffered his illness during the game against Leeds in October 2001, assistant manager Phil Thompson assumed control in a caretaker role.

Almost a decade later, Thompson opened up on those months and Houllier's eventual return, saying: "Above all it shouldn't be forgotten that [Gerard] nearly gave his life for Liverpool, just so he could make the club great again."

How does Houllier himself look back on that period now?

"I took a high risk in coming back too early," he admits. "But we had a deal with Phil.

"Phil was in charge of the team at the time and I said: 'Maybe I will come back for the Roma game. It might give a bit of a boost to the team'. He said 'definitely'.

"But in hindsight I can say it was far too early. Only five months later..."


Houllier adds: "The fans are special in Liverpool. I will never forget that. Whether they support Everton or Liverpool. They all wished me well when I fell ill.

"It's a special city with really privileged fans. That's why it is a real reward for them with Klopp winning the title."


A league triumph may have been narrowly out of grasp for Houllier the manager.

But Houllier the “supporter” will relish number 19 as much as any dedicated Kopite in the city he still adores.
 
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Gerard Houllier likes to deal in threes.

He won a magnificent cup treble back in 2001 when he was in charge of Liverpool.

And he believes there is a hat-trick of good reasons why the current crop have just claimed the Premier League title.

Houllier explains: "One, they've been together for two years to work, train and play. There is a tactical harmony. The team is coming to full maturity now.

"Second, the buys of Virgil van Dijk and Alisson were pivotal in the title quest. When those two came into the team, it was different. They won the Champions League last year and that tells you everything.

"And three, Jurgen Klopp. He gives so much enthusiasm and confidence to the whole squad. The team would go through hell and fire for him.
"

Houllier takes an extra moment to pay tribute to the man who has led Liverpool's recent return to the pinnacle of world football.

He says: "When you work in Liverpool, you've got to give 100%. I would even say 150%. You've got to give your all because that is the way people expect you to be.

"Jurgen gives more than you can see. If you combine his passion, his experience and his work, you have got a very successful cocktail.

"I enjoy the way they play. It's a very kind of generous football, which goes well with the generosity of people in Liverpool.

"The commitment and engagement of the team at the moment fits well with the spirit of the town."

In the modern era of Liverpool, it is tempting to track a lineage between the successful foreign managers who have occupied the dugout.

Houllier's triple cup haul put the Reds back in business as he also professionalised the set-up behind the scenes.

Rafa Benitez built on that success, turning Liverpool into Champions League winners and title challengers.

And Klopp has taken it even further by ending the 30-year wait for domestic glory along with adding a sixth European Cup to the trophy cabinet.

I pose this line of succession theory to Houllier but it is quickly dismissed.

He says: "It would be very presumptuous to say that.

"Every manager has got something he can improve when he succeeds.

"When you are a manager, you need results and trophies. In Liverpool winning silverware is important.

"Second, you need to leave a legacy. That means you need to leave a team so the one who comes after you doesn't have to spend all his money. And also a legacy in terms of habits.

"And the third thing is to make players improve and to make your team improve. To make them progress.

"You mentioned Rafa and Jurgen. Obviously what I had to do in 1998 and the early 2000s does not [relate to] now in 2020. Rafa came after me. We cannot say we won the title!

"But we did our bit at the right time and hopefully the club benefited from that. For me, I was the first foreign coach. It was a turning point. We were moving from the boot room tradition to something different."


What is beyond doubt, however, is the role Houllier played in the careers of two current Anfield stars.

For the best part of a decade, the 72-year-old has worked as Head of Global Football for Red Bull.

He has overseen sporting development of the brand's entire roster of clubs, including Salzburg in Austria and Leipzig in Germany.

And his watchful eye spotted the untapped talents of Sadio Mane and Naby Keita.

Houllier says: "I saw Mane during the Olympic Games in 2012. He was at Metz and we bought him at the time for €4m at Red Bull Salzburg.

"He played two years and won a [league and cup] double. Then he ran away to go to Southampton! And then on to Liverpool.

"He has become more and more composed. Very focused and more composed in front of goal particularly. He can make goals but he can also score goals."

Houllier was impressed when he first spotted Keita in action too. And he believes the Guinean can deliver for the Reds in seasons to come.

He says: "Keita was playing for a 'championship' team in France. They were struggling but he was playing everyone off the park.

"Like when I saw Steven Gerrard; he was practically everywhere and his maturity was impressive, even under pressure. I recommended Salzburg buy him and they followed me.

"He has a good attitude. Once he fits in the [Liverpool] team, he will stay there."

Another Liverpool trinity recently came together when Klopp was on the phone to Houllier as he walked through Formby - only to bump into neighbour Steven Gerrard.

Houllier has known Klopp for a while and the pair get on well: "We used to come across each other at meetings in UEFA.
"In Dortmund they sing You'll Never Walk Alone too. I was a supporter of Dortmund and he was a supporter of Liverpool!"
Klopp's next challenge is to try and turn one title into a Red dynasty.

And Houllier believes his friend is well equipped to do just that despite some obvious obstacles.

He says: "The team is still young and it will unlock something inside them. Winning the league will give so much confidence for the next season.

"It's more difficult at the moment because you have Manchester City, United, Chelsea, Leicester now and all those teams.

"But the same effect we had with the first win in the League Cup [in 2001 to spark the treble], it could be the same with winning this league today.

"Don't forget - last season they deserved it as well! City had to perform fantastically to beat Liverpool.

"97 points. Only one defeat. Normally when you go over 90 points you win the title."

When lockdown is finally lifted and Liverpool's league-winning party can truly begin, the city may welcome a very special guest.

Is Houllier planning to return to the place he called home for six years to celebrate?

The answer is instant: "Definitely. And to congratulate the lads and Jurgen!"
 
What a decent man he is. Never afraid to promote himself and his achievements (as Rafa no doubt will attest - but that in itself is a bit pot and kettle!), but a very good person all the same.

Thinking about his time here as I read the above, one of the things that struck me was: for all his disciplinarian reputation, he never really got his squad anywhere near as coherent and committed as Klopp has done. After booting out Ince, he still had Fowler being 'difficult,' and when he got rid of Fowler he still had idiots like Diouf. Never the close-knitted bunch there is today. Same goes to a lesser extent for Rafa. It just highlights what a brilliant judge of character, and what a great man-manager, Klopp is.

Another thing: I wish, Ged mate, you'd have spotted the quality of talents for us as you've since done for Red Bull!!!

But he did kick start things. It'll be entirely apt for him to be shown around the new training base at Kirkby, because he certainly started the professionalisation of that aspect of the club.
 
The job that faced GH when he took sole charge was a very difficult one. The club had been drifting for too long (mainly Moores' fault, partly Uncle Roy's) and needed more than a dash of vinegar added to the mixture because of the absence of character and simple professionalism infecting the squad at the time. Incidentally, while you rightly identify one or two names there, from the outside looking in it always looked to me like McManaman was the real ringleader of the malaise within the squad, and TBH I'm amazed he's been allowed to get his feet back under the table to the extent that he has more recently.

GH went at the job with a will and was the agent of change the club needed at the time. Regrettably he turned out not to be the right man then to move us forward into a more positive new era, too inflexible to cope with the inevitable risks involved in starting to loosen the reins. The more he flailed around trying, with increasing desperation and decreasing success, to save his job and his régime, the clearer it became to me that he was in serious danger of adulterating his legacy. That legacy is substantially in credit IMO and would, I feel sure, be viewed more positively by more fans now if he'd left sooner.
 
What a decent man he is. Never afraid to promote himself and his achievements (as Rafa no doubt will attest - but that in itself is a bit pot and kettle!), but a very good person all the same.

Thinking about his time here as I read the above, one of the things that struck me was: for all his disciplinarian reputation, he never really got his squad anywhere near as coherent and committed as Klopp has done. After booting out Ince, he still had Fowler being 'difficult,' and when he got rid of Fowler he still had idiots like Diouf. Never the close-knitted bunch there is today. Same goes to a lesser extent for Rafa. It just highlights what a brilliant judge of character, and what a great man-manager, Klopp is.

Another thing: I wish, Ged mate, you'd have spotted the quality of talents for us as you've since done for Red Bull!!!

But he did kick start things. It'll be entirely apt for him to be shown around the new training base at Kirkby, because he certainly started the professionalisation of that aspect of the club.

The one thing that he did do badly was be stubborn with players and not see a way back for them once he fell out with them. He did it to Babbel and Henchoz, which was frustrating as he then didn't do his homework on people like Diouf (who was a nutcase) and Cheyrou and Biscan (who weren't mentally strong enough). But I did like him. He set the ball rolling in putting us back on the European Map and bringing in the professionalism we were already losing ground on with the likes of Wenger at Arsenal.

He bought good and bad, much like Rafa, and at times we were close to being scintillating title contenders, while at others we were fucking awful to watch and completely lacking in inspiration.

There were alot of stepping stones over the last 30 years, with the obvious missteps too, but I like to think Ged, Rafa, Kenny and Brendan all played their part in instilling "something" that got us there in the end. Even if it was via knowing what it's like to win against the odds, or knowing the bitterness of getting close but not quite close enough, as well as the intermittent moments of glory where we did pick up silverware. They all did their bit in giving us something to get excited about, but not close to what Klopp has given us over the last 2 seasons.
 
I liked Houllier. He certainly did a lot of good and he gave us that one great season in 2001. We played some wonderful football that year.

Sadly he couldn't build on that. We may have finished second the following season but the odd decisions began and only got worse the year after. He never seemed to get back on track after that so it was inevitable that he had to go. Possibly a season too late.

Over the past thirty years though he did better than some of our managers, and deservedly has more to show for it.
 
His attitude to Litmanen niggled me a lot. I loved that player. It's one thing to shun players like that, but to go out and buy him only to seem like you don't trust him was just silly. He was eager not only to play but also to help shape younger players, and we basically just pushed him away. Very odd.
 
There were some happy times during the 30 years of hurt and some of them did come under Houllier.

I remember I had just moved down to London and was living in a shitty part of town with 2 flatmates both United fans... We drew at old Trafford... and if I remember rightly Berger had put us 1 nil up but we conceded despite being the better team... I dunno... it was 20 years ago now!

I do remember Owen coming on an as a sub and missing a great chance...

All this is almost irrelevant to my point!!

I do remember was the Sky cunts... (and if there are any youngsters on here they might not understand why I call em cunts Sky was basically a 24/7 advert for Man U back then)...In the Sky interview after the match, Sky was doing there usual pro-Manc wind-up bullshit and you could see how gutted and angry Houllier was and he just came out and said " I promise you we will beat those cunts", he didn't actually swear obviously but that's what I could hear him saying subliminally... you could see the passion in him...

There I was gutted and suffering listening to two flatmates gloating and hearing Houllier just made me smile on the inside cos I KNEW he fucking meant it.

Sure enough, I think the next time we went to Old Toilet Danny Murphy pinged in a fucking beauty of a free-kick.

Yeah... some happy times were had even without titles.
 
Danny Murphy was the secret to beating the mancs, year in year out

I remember the league cup final in Cardiff; I had spent the whole of Saturday from 9am SIngapore time to 4pm London time drinking whisky in biz clas, then met my mate to be driven to Cardiff and out on the piss until about 3am. Felt 100% the next day, sat through 120 minutes, a Fowler beauty, an equaliser I forget, a penalty that should have been and penalties and then sang "Hou, Hou, Hou let the reds out" til I was hoarse
 
you could see how gutted and angry Houllier was and he just came out and said " I promise you we will beat those cunts",

That's amazing, that's always stuck in my head, I can see and hear that interview in my mind right now.
 
His attitude to Litmanen niggled me a lot. I loved that player. It's one thing to shun players like that, but to go out and buy him only to seem like you don't trust him was just silly. He was eager not only to play but also to help shape younger players, and we basically just pushed him away. Very odd.

There was a story doing the rounds at the time about that and I'd be interested to know whether you reckon it has the ring of truth.

What was said was that the problem started during a training session one day. As an ex-striker himself GH was taking the strikers' training sessions at the time, got miffed when he saw Jari L talking to Emile Heskey about something and told Jari fairly unceremoniously to leave off. Jari was mildly irritated by this (even that was unusual for such a dignified guy) and was said to have replied "Well, someone better have a chat to him because no-one's doing it at the moment". His card was apparently marked from that moment on, which - given the way GH dealt with some other players - I can well believe.

When Jari left I remember Grungefuttock, late of this parish, putting it in a nutshell: "Either we shouldn't have bought Jari or we should have played him. Best of luck to a great player and a fine man who deserved better from us". Word.
 
There was a story doing the rounds at the time about that and I'd be interested to know whether you reckon it has the ring of truth.

What was said was that the problem started during a training session one day. As an ex-striker himself GH was taking the strikers' training sessions at the time, got miffed when he saw Jari L talking to Emile Heskey about something and told Jari fairly unceremoniously to leave off. Jari was mildly irritated by this (even that was unusual for such a dignified guy) and was said to have replied "Well, someone better have a chat to him because no-one's doing it at the moment". His card was apparently marked from that moment on, which - given the way GH dealt with some other players - I can well believe.

Yes, that's exactly what I heard. Very sad, really, if true.
 
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