Liverpool sack Rafa Benitez

[Ryan]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=40455.msg1114731#msg1114731 date=1275891833]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=40455.msg1114713#msg1114713 date=1275883092]
[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=40455.msg1114709#msg1114709 date=1275879701]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=40455.msg1114699#msg1114699 date=1275873769]
[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=40455.msg1114432#msg1114432 date=1275838061]
OUr problem with zonal marking was that we had too many bad players; it worked pretty well before with Rafa
[/quote]

Which is almost completely incorrect.
[/quote]

But why is that the case?

A lot of criticism has always been levelled at Rafa for zonal marking; especially from Steve Mcmahon and some others.Pretty much eveytime we lost a game we'd hear someone muttering either about zonal marking or rotation (or both)

BUt there was a time when it did work very well, our defence in 2008 and 2007 was good.There was a season when we lost 2 games to the Mancs' 4; but all the draws put us in 3rd place.So it's more likely an issue of personnel, rather than the system employed.
[/quote]

Most critics' and 'expert ex-pros' in the press haven't a fucking clue mate, as evidenced by their continual usage of such drivel as "I've never seen a zone score a goal, but I've seen a player wah wah wah" - which is by some distance the most resoundingly stupid fucking thing I've ever heard.

McMahon falls into that category, as does literally Jamie Redknapp, Paul Walsh, etc.

Records showed that for years under Rafa our set-piece defending was the best in the league whilst we were deploying zonal marking (I think thats the point you made anyway). I rememebr reading an interview with Rafa in which he attributed a lot of that success to the tall players we had in the side at that time too - Hyypia, Crouch, Sissoko, etc. I think it's probably safe to say that in the last year under Rafa we were nowhere near as strong with it as the system, probably due to a number of factors - lack of taller players, ever-changing team due to injuries, teams working out how to play against it better, less solid defence, etc etc.
[/quote]

In fairness, that's not too far off what Avvy originally said.
[/quote]

Yeah, I think I misread Avvy's first email, and didn't notice the "with" bit at first glance.

 

[manwithnoname]

I think it's probably safe to say that in the last year under Rafa we were nowhere near as strong with it as the system, probably due to a number of factors - lack of taller players, ever-changing team due to injuries, teams working out how to play against it better, less solid defence, etc etc.

But he still continued to play it, despite not having the personnel to do so.

Which is hardly a new phenomenon for Benitez, with regards to formations and tactics.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Brendan link=topic=40455.msg1114778#msg1114778 date=1275897600]

I think it's probably safe to say that in the last year under Rafa we were nowhere near as strong with it as the system, probably due to a number of factors - lack of taller players, ever-changing team due to injuries, teams working out how to play against it better, less solid defence, etc etc.

But he still continued to play it, despite not having the personnel to do so.

Which is hardly a new phenomenon for Benitez, with regards to formations and tactics.
[/quote]

totally agree bren, work within your means.
look at the lucas/mash combo, from day one it was a creativity vacuum.
if losing xabi was out of his hands then continuing with mash/lucas most certainly was not.

 

[LadyRed]

[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=40455.msg1113359#msg1113359 date=1275670047]
just read that gerrard said he's deffo staying at liverpool.
[/quote]

Any links for this yet?

 

[vantage]

[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=40455.msg1114857#msg1114857 date=1275902830]
[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=40455.msg1113359#msg1113359 date=1275670047]
just read that gerrard said he's deffo staying at liverpool.
[/quote]

Any links for this yet?
[/quote]

Has he convinced his bum boy to stay as well?

 

[themn]

[quote author=vantage link=topic=40455.msg1114863#msg1114863 date=1275903293]
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=40455.msg1114857#msg1114857 date=1275902830]
[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=40455.msg1113359#msg1113359 date=1275670047]
just read that gerrard said he's deffo staying at liverpool.
[/quote]

Any links for this yet?
[/quote]

Has he convinced his bum boy to stay as well?
[/quote]

Is Johnno leaving ?

 

[LadyRed]

I love that picture.

 

[themn]

I know.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

Carra:

"I would like to thank Rafael Benitez for what he did for me and wish him luck at Inter Milan," said Carragher.

Torres:

“I have nothing but respect for Rafa and he has taught me a lot. But I can’t think about that ­situation now".

Mascher:

"At the moment I really know little about my future.

"But of course with Benitez at Liverpool I experienced three incredible years. His football is my football."

Pepe:

"It's a sad moment for Liverpool, for Rafa Benítez and for the players who have been with him," "He was a very important person for the club for six years. Liverpool grew with him and Rafa also grew thanks to Liverpool.

"I hope that this crisis passes. That a person so important for the club as Rafa Benítez has left is news that you never would have expected and that you never would have believed," he added. "The only thing left for me is to thank him for his confidence during all this time. I wish him the best of luck."

 

[Ryan]

Has Dirk said anything yet?

 

[Jürgen4PM]

Kuyt: I am grateful to Benitez for signing me for Liverpool

Dirk Kuyt admits he will always be grateful to former Liverpool boss Rafa Benitez.

"I do not know who will be the coach of Inter, but it is obvious that Rafa Benitez is a fantastic coach, as Liverpool did very well, I am very grateful to him because he brought me to England," said Kuyt.


His agent:

"Dirk is thinking now only about the World Cup.

"He has an excellent relationship with Benitez, but we are commenting only on an hypothesis, because there is nothing concrete. When and if an offer arrives, we'll see.

"Dirk is happy at Liverpool and has a contract until 2012.

"Would he follow Benitez? Anything is possible, but, again, there is currently nothing."

 

[Sunny]

So Kuyt is going then. We'll have 25m for Masher and 15m for Kuyt thanks Rafa

 

[LeTallecWiz]

I wonder if people will be as harsh with Dirk as his agent has left the door rather open for him to leave when the offer comes in ...

Oh well, I'd want 45+ Sunny ...

 

[TheBunnyman]

Let's sell EVERYONE and play a bunch of kids instead! Yes, we'd probably get relegated, but at least we'd get rid of the debt, allowing us to build a new stadium.

 

[Y1]

Have we not sacked Rafa yet? If so, what is the need to bring up this thread?

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=Y1 link=topic=40455.msg1120109#msg1120109 date=1276592479]
Have we not sacked Rafa yet? If so, what is the need to bring up this thread?
[/quote]

It's just a few comments from some of our players on our ex manager. Whats the problem mate?

 

[Y1]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40455.msg1120111#msg1120111 date=1276592704]
[quote author=Y1 link=topic=40455.msg1120109#msg1120109 date=1276592479]
Have we not sacked Rafa yet? If so, what is the need to bring up this thread?
[/quote]

It's just a few comments from some of our players on our ex manager. Whats the problem mate?
[/quote]

No problem, just hate to see all the buried rubbish being trawled out here again.

 

[themn]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40455.msg1120111#msg1120111 date=1276592704]
[quote author=Y1 link=topic=40455.msg1120109#msg1120109 date=1276592479]
Have we not sacked Rafa yet? If so, what is the need to bring up this thread?
[/quote]

It's just a few comments from some of our players on our ex manager. Whats the problem mate?
[/quote]

It's ruining our World Cup !

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40455.msg1120107#msg1120107 date=1276592315]
Let's sell EVERYONE and play a bunch of kids instead! Yes, we'd probably get relegated, but at least we'd get rid of the debt, allowing us to build a new stadium.
[/quote]

I could live with that.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40455.msg1120107#msg1120107 date=1276592315]
Let's sell EVERYONE and play a bunch of kids instead! Yes, we'd probably get relegated, but at least we'd get rid of the debt, allowing us to build a new stadium.
[/quote]

It amazes me that people are happy to see players going. Yossi goes, now Kuyt and Masher are rumoured and people seem delighted like we'll suddenly go out and buy someone better. We won't. And Stevie and Torres are hardly going to be looking at the situation in the same light either. It was bad enough last year, the former three players who are rumoured to be going (and Reina) are our next best outside of Torres and Gerrard.

I guess people are made up Jovanovic might not be signing. We need everything we can get.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40455.msg1120129#msg1120129 date=1276593618]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40455.msg1120107#msg1120107 date=1276592315]
Let's sell EVERYONE and play a bunch of kids instead! Yes, we'd probably get relegated, but at least we'd get rid of the debt, allowing us to build a new stadium.
[/quote]

It amazes me that people are happy to see players going. Yossi goes, now Kuyt and Masher are rumoured and people seem delighted like we'll suddenly go out and buy someone better. We won't. And Stevie and Torres are hardly going to be looking at the situation in the same light either. It was bad enough last year, the former three players who are rumoured to be going (and Reina) are our next best outside of Torres and Gerrard.

I guess people are made up Jovanovic might not be signing. We need everything we can get.
[/quote]

normally when top players are sold I'm hopefully that they'll be replaced and we carry on as normal but in the situation we now find ourselves there is no gurantee whatsoever the money will be reinvested into the squad. how the fuck did this come to this in the space of THREE YEARS. I'm coming round to the idea of administration if rids us of those two parasites.

 

[Sunny]

I don't think people are happy Mark. More resigned to it. I doubt any money will be ploughed into the team. We're really fucked.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=40455.msg1120137#msg1120137 date=1276594246]
I don't think people are happy Mark. More resigned to it. I doubt any money will be ploughed into the team. We're really fucked.
[/quote]

^

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=40455.msg1120137#msg1120137 date=1276594246]
I don't think people are happy Mark. More resigned to it. I doubt any money will be ploughed into the team. We're really fucked.
[/quote]

I don't know mate, there's a whole load of shrugging going on in the Yossi thread. And much the same regards Masher and Kuyt.

EDIT - and it's clearly not a shrug of resignation, but more one of "well he's not that good anyway", which is not really a stance we can afford ourselves right now, when the replacements are likely to be fuck all.

 

[Squiggles]

We don't need to operate at a massive net spend to keep up expectations.

We're just used to pissing money away left, right and centre on players we do not need or ones we refuse to play.

Hopefully the new manager will be able to operate the purse strings a lot more effectively that the man he replaced.

 

[Oncy]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40455.msg1120145#msg1120145 date=1276595965]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=40455.msg1120137#msg1120137 date=1276594246]
I don't think people are happy Mark. More resigned to it. I doubt any money will be ploughed into the team. We're really fucked.
[/quote]

I don't know mate, there's a whole load of shrugging going on in the Yossi thread. And much the same regards Masher and Kuyt.
[/quote]From a personal viewpoint, for me its more the defence mechanism of being rejected in our hour of need.
I dont Reaaaaalllly want anyone to leave, but if players want to leave then fuck em.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=40455.msg1120149#msg1120149 date=1276596214]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40455.msg1120145#msg1120145 date=1276595965]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=40455.msg1120137#msg1120137 date=1276594246]
I don't think people are happy Mark. More resigned to it. I doubt any money will be ploughed into the team. We're really fucked.
[/quote]

I don't know mate, there's a whole load of shrugging going on in the Yossi thread. And much the same regards Masher and Kuyt.
[/quote]From a personal viewpoint, for me its more the defence mechanism of being rejected in our hour of need.
I dont Reaaaaalllly want anyone to leave, but if players want to leave then fuck em.
[/quote]

Well yeah, there's that side of it, which is making me even more bitter towards the game and the players who seem all too ready to make their future's with us as hazy as possible.

 

[Oncy]

Jonjo and Reheeeeeeem FTMFW!!!

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=40455.msg1120151#msg1120151 date=1276596354]
Jonjo and Reheeeeeeem FTMFW!!!
[/quote]

Yep! We might no longer have no excuses regards playing kids!

 

[monsieurdantes]

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=40455.msg1120149#msg1120149 date=1276596214]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40455.msg1120145#msg1120145 date=1276595965]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=40455.msg1120137#msg1120137 date=1276594246]
I don't think people are happy Mark. More resigned to it. I doubt any money will be ploughed into the team. We're really fucked.
[/quote]

I don't know mate, there's a whole load of shrugging going on in the Yossi thread. And much the same regards Masher and Kuyt.
[/quote]From a personal viewpoint, for me its more the defence mechanism of being rejected in our hour of need.
I dont Reaaaaalllly want anyone to leave, but if players want to leave then fuck em.
[/quote]

are you kidding me? there's a massive long list of people that need to be fucked off. and not a single one of them must be replaced under any circumstances. that's not depressing in my eyes, thats progress.