Sunlit Uplands

[singlerider]

Richey - what's the sense like on the inside?

Are people starting to see Boris as a liability now?

Or is the lack of viable alternative (seeing as they've done a reasonably effective smear job on Sunak) mean there's a bit of a siege mentality going on?

 

[peterhague]

Richey - what's the sense like on the inside?

Are people starting to see Boris as a liability now?

Or is the lack of viable alternative (seeing as they've done a reasonably effective smear job on Sunak) mean there's a bit of a siege mentality going on?

They've still got Liz "British cheese for British people" Truss.

 

[singlerider]

They've still got Liz "British cheese for British people" Truss.

Ha!

 

[Richey]

Richey - what's the sense like on the inside?

Are people starting to see Boris as a liability now?

Or is the lack of viable alternative (seeing as they've done a reasonably effective smear job on Sunak) mean there's a bit of a siege mentality going on?

A few months ago there were quite a few people who thought he should go. That was when the whole party thing was at it's strongest. That kind of feeling does appear to have reduced since then though.

The Tory Party wants to win elections, ultimately, so we will see what happens in the local elections in May. If the Tories take a massive beating then the knives will be out for Boris again, but if not, they won't be. It's really as simple as that. Unlike the Labour Party, the Tory Party won't hang onto a leader who looks like they will lose an election. They can be pretty ruthless in getting rid.

The lack of alternative is a bit of an issue I think though. If there had been an obvious person a few months ago then Boris might have been in more trouble. Ultimately though, that wouldn't stop him being removed if he was a clear electoral liability.

 

[singlerider]

Interesting, thanks!

So results in May will be the litmus test...is there much fear that by that point the failure to do something sooner might reflect badly?

Or are they thinking they can weather the storm?

What's the general view on Boris? Do people pinch their nose and point to his (previous) popularity with the public? Or are they genuinely into him?

 

[The Nomad]

The main issue I have with it is the whole 'there's a war on so we should stick with what we have'.

Fuck that, we've replaced many a prime minister during wars. Churchill was elected during WWII.

France is literally going through a GE right now.

But the Tories and the right leaning tabloids are sticking with 'Now isn't the time'. And the public are parroting it.

 

[singlerider]

I mean...I know "better the Devil you know" and all that, but I struggle to see how they could find someone much worse than Boris...

Except Dorries of course.

 

[Richey]

Interesting, thanks!

So results in May will be the litmus test...is there much fear that by that point the failure to do something sooner might reflect badly?

Or are they thinking they can weather the storm?

What's the general view on Boris? Do people pinch their nose and point to his (previous) popularity with the public? Or are they genuinely into him?

I am sure there are some who think he is amazing. I don’t know those people, but then I don’t get involved with the national Conservative Party, never ever been to the Party Conference or anything like that.

For a lot of people who are actively involved in politics, their interest is local first and foremost. They want a local MP from their party, they want their council controlled by their party. If the party leader helps this, great. If they hinder this, they should go.

I suspect that the reason he was voted in as leader was for many people, that he could win an election. And he did. He does have the ability to make himself popular. Clearly at the moment he isn’t very popular but there probably is a sense that he can turn that around where others in the same position might not be able to. I mean, if you think about it, the career of politicians at the very very top is, what, 10 years? 15? Boris has been around and very much in the public eye for about 20. In that time he has had all kinds of scandals, all kinds of fuck ups yet he always seems to not only bounce back but bounce upwards. That also probably buys him a bit of time.

 

[Richey]

I mean...I know "better the Devil you know" and all that, but I struggle to see how they could find someone much worse than Boris...

Except Dorries of course.

Jacob Rees Mogg? Priti Patel? Michael Gove?

 

[singlerider]

Jacob Rees Mogg? Priti Patel? Michael Gove?

Hmmm...you *do* make a fairly compelling point...

 

[peterhague]

Fucking Gove, man. I reckon if he'd been in charge we'd be living in a nuclear wasteland right now.

 

[singlerider]

I don't know why, but for some reason Priti Patel has always looked like a pornstar playing a secretary to me

 

[Atlas]

I mean...I know "better the Devil you know" and all that, but I struggle to see how they could find someone much worse than Boris...

Except Dorries of course.

I bet there are literally a dozen people on this list. @Richey has named a few but Lizz Truss, Dom Raab another couple to add.

TBH, we might aswell go Fabricant and just be done with it all. go full out IDGAF

 

[peterhague]

I don't know why, but for some reason Priti Patel has always looked like a pornstar playing a secretary to me

LOL she definitely does.

 

[singlerider]

"Dictation you say?"

 

[737Max]

"Dictation you say?"

Look at her trying to be all Mia Khaliffa

 

[Lippy]

She's a complete cow, but the housing issue does irritate me a bit in how utterly London-centric it is. In most of the rest of the country it's simply not as issue to anywhere the same extent.

It's not GOOD, either, and property everywhere is dearer than it should be, but in most place two people on the minimum wage are able to get a mortgage for a reasonable flat, providing they can save £10k or so for a deposit; and that isn't THAT much of an ask, really.

Maybe it's because the economy is so London and SE centric

 

[peterhague]

Maybe it's because the economy is so London and SE centric

Well, everything is really. I find it pretty annoying.

 

[Holle]

Look at her trying to be all Mia Khaliffa

I'd help her with that.

 

[737Max]

I'd help her with that.

Hahahahaha

 

[The Nomad]

Meanwhile in France.. what a choice they have to make. I'd argue its worse than Boris vs Corbyn that we had.

Macron vs Le Pen

 

[Richey]

Meanwhile in France.. what a choice they have to make. I'd argue its worse than Boris vs Corbyn that we had.

Macron vs Le Pen

Yes it probably is!

I admit I don't really follow many elections in other countries but it does seem like a bit of a theme.

The last two US elections being further examples.

 

[Atlas]

Seems it's pretty similar in most countries..
Just horrible candidates across the board, the seemingly progressive candidate is aa crap as the right winger

 

[rubans]

Didn't realise the right to remove nationality vote today (Nationality and Borders Bill Amendment) was focused specifically on those with rights to live in another country even if you have never ever been there but can be done without notice. When I say rights, I mean you how far back do the go? presumably just skin pigmentation or funny sounding names will be enough.
Interesting world we are living in now.


Won't be surprised if there is a video out there of Priti Patel clubbing baby seals.

 

[jexykrodic]

Didn't realise the right to remove nationality vote today (Nationality and Borders Bill Amendment) was focused specifically on those with rights to live in another country even if you have never ever been there but can be done without notice. When I say rights, I mean you how far back do the go? presumably just skin pigmentation or funny sounding names will be enough.
Interesting world we are living in now.


Won't be surprised if there is a video out there of Priti Patel clubbing baby seals.

Just give me a passport and don't do any checks. Ignore the fact I passed through many safe countries along the way.

Oh and just in case you have doubts or reservations I'll throw the R word in there.

 

[Woland]

Jeebus. We've got ten times less refugees than Germany, three times less than France, and people still don't know that the 'crisis' here is wholly manufactured to divide us.

 

[jexykrodic]

I'm fine with each state running it's own immigration processes and policies.

 

[Woland]

If you don't think any of these people's problems are our responsibility when we've been bombing the shit out of their region for decades then I guess that makes you like a teenage Boris wandering out of a restaurant he's just trashed.

 

[jexykrodic]

If you don't think any of these people's problems are our responsibility when we've been bombing the shit out of their region for decades then I guess that makes you like a teenage Boris wandering out of a restaurant he's just trashed.

Wanting to make proper checks on potential immigrants is good sense for many reasons. Everyone wants to aid deserving cases but checks are essential.

 

[rubans]

Just give me a passport and don't do any checks. Ignore the fact I passed through many safe countries along the way.

Oh and just in case you have doubts or reservations I'll throw the R word in there.

It’s nothing to do with giving you a passport, it’s about taking it away from those that have it when they like.

If you think this bill is just about protecting against those willing to travel over rubber dingies for now and future then I think you are completely missing the point.
It’s about the wider narrative on this most inept of governments erroding into civil liberties that this country has worked hard to build over a period of time than longer than people like Mrs Patel have been alive. It’s got potential to be misused immensly and have more wide reaching then what they tried on with Windrush.