The Donkey

[mark1975]

Quansah played this season on merit, and in the end deserved to be in there ahead of Konate who, right now, looks spent and unfit. He's looked sluggish and sloppy whenever he's played.

The mistakes from Quansah, not that there have been many, have just been down to experience. He looks quality in every sense.

 

[Hansern]

I thought this season alone shows the value of a great academy, and the importance of integrating it at the Axa.

 

[Frogfish]

So why bother having an academy at all? Pumping tens of millions into something with the small hope you get a one in a generation player seems counter intuitive when you may as well put that money to a more established player.

I don’t have an Xpert eleven academy because it is a waste of money.

Edit. Yes I know the academy delivers more than just potential superstars but those we can sell for a mill or two. Plus it looks good on the balance sheet.

10s of millions? For the rest I think you answered your own question ! It's still a positive net cash flow.

Are there any regulations regarding PL teams having to have Home Grown? Ditto UEFA? Not sure how those apply. Stevie will know.,

 

[MomoWASright]

10s of millions? For the rest I think you answered your own question ! It's still a positive net cash flow.

Are there any regulations regarding PL teams having to have Home Grown? Ditto UEFA? Not sure how those apply. Stevie will know.,

You do know I was being a dick with that.

For the quota it helps with non UK spots in the squad. They also don’t use up a space up to a certain age. Whereas we have bums like Adrian, Thiago and Nunez using up some of our 17 non uk trained squad spaces.

 

[tomasjj]

Kolleger, Stefan, Jones, Trent. Bradley, Elliot and Quansah show The value of The academy.
There could have been more if Klopp had been more open to using them.

 

[StevieM]

10s of millions? For the rest I think you answered your own question ! It's still a positive net cash flow.

Are there any regulations regarding PL teams having to have Home Grown? Ditto UEFA? Not sure how those apply. Stevie will know.,

You don’t have to have any - it just limits your squad - in the same way not having really good youth players does.

We’re started games with 11 OS players… I think.

 

[MomoWASright]

You don’t have to have any - it just limits your squad - in the same way not having really good youth players does.

We’re started games with 11 OS players… I think.

We had a game a few weeks ago where we started eleven different nationalities for the first time.

 

[StevieM]

Kolleger, Stefan, Jones, Trent. Bradley, Elliot and Quansah show The value of The academy.
There could have been more if Klopp had been more open to using them.

Jordan Ibe showed the value of the Academy too when we fleeced Bournemouth.

 

[StevieM]

And whatsisface that we got £20m off Sheffield Utd for so that he could never play for them.

 

[MomoWASright]

Brewster

 

[Fabio]

If the academy has produced fuck all why would we be given the chance to see that? I'm not following your train of thought here. Not good enough = no minutes but plenty have been given them so I can't see the issue.

We don't know if they're good enough though is my point, because we've barely given anyone a consistent run out. You shouldn't have to be generational to work your way in to a side. Like I know it's a consistent theme of Liverpool that if you're good enough you don't tend to go out on loan (unless the manager actively dislikes you).

It's the thing I don't get, other teams manage to give minutes to players they're hopeful of breaking through a bit more consistently than we do. For me, with hindsight (as it's not something I'd overly thought of), it seems to have been giving seasoned pros the chance to see out comfy wins (e.g. bringing on Gomez,) rather than trying to give minutes to youth. This polish Messi that was hyped to the moon, didn't see a sniff of the bench for a majority of the time he was here. I'm trying to find minutes played stats for solanke (I know he made 27 appearances), and here he is fully developed looking like a decent player. Thankfully we made a decent profit on him.

I dunno. It just seems like a weird blind spot.

 

[Fabio]

Quansah being like Nat Phillips is complete bullshit too, man was good enough to start against top sides even with Konate fit ffs. Big Nat is a good example of someone who should have been our starting defender by that logic actually

I used the example of NAT Phillips not on ability, but on the fact klopps.only played him as much due to injury. If konate was more robust, or matip was back by Jan, quansah would have a lot less minutes. Again, not a slight on quansah ability; more on klopps reluctance to use kids

 

[the count]

And whatsisface that we got £20m off Sheffield Utd for so that he could never play for them.

So good a deal they made a movie about it.

 

[Richey]

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle to be honest.

Whereas Klopp isn't generally bringing young players in and making them first team regulars, he has at least used young players to fill in gaps when needed.

I mean, back in the Houllier and Benitez days, if a first teamer was injured we would have been more likely to see a short term signing, or a loan or a first teamer played out of position.

I doubt the likes of Quansah, Kelleher, Bradley and Jones would have much of a look-in back then.

 

[MomoWASright]

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle to be honest.

Whereas Klopp isn't generally bringing young players in and making them first team regulars, he has at least used young players to fill in gaps when needed.

I mean, back in the Houllier and Benitez days, if a first teamer was injured we would have been more likely to see a short term signing, or a loan or a first teamer played out of position.

I doubt the likes of Quansah, Kelleher, Bradley and Jones would have much of a look-in back then.

I think you’re right.

I’ve just looked at some quotes after the league cup final.

"What happened here was absolutely insane, these things are not possible. The team, a squad, an academy full of character. I am so proud I could be part of that tonight.

"The craziest thing is we deserved it. We had lucky moments, they had lucky moments. The boys showed up, it was really cool."

Here is Klopp acknowledging the kids, even going as far to say they showed up. Which brings me back to my original point that he hasn’t really given them the opportunity to show up again despite some first teamers not showing up.

 

[Hansern]

If true, Mendes probably have the pulling power to send him somewhere for a decent fee. PSG maybe?

Radio Fénix journalist Nicolás Saavedra: "Mendes wants him [Nuñez] to leave Liverpool. He’s a footballer whom he holds in very high regard and he has other aspirations for him."

 

[Beamrider]

If true, Mendes probably have the pulling power to send him somewhere for a decent fee. PSG maybe?

Radio Fénix journalist Nicolás Saavedra: "Mendes wants him [Nuñez] to leave Liverpool. He’s a footballer whom he holds in very high regard and he has other aspirations for him."

Nunez has been here two years. Mendes will have had the full instalments on his agency fee for him, so he either wants the boy to sign a new deal (extra fee for Georgie) or to move on (extra, and much bigger, fee for Georgie). He holds Nunez's agency fee earning potential in high regard, nothing more.

 

[Richey]

I don't mind if we keep Nunez (as long as we don't rely on him for goals), but he's hardly in a position to start playing silly transfer games.

If he (or more likely his agent) want to look elsewhere then fine, go ahead.

 

[Hansern]

Nunez has been here two years. Mendes will have had the full instalments on his agency fee for him, so he either wants the boy to sign a new deal (extra fee for Georgie) or to move on (extra, and much bigger, fee for Georgie). He holds Nunez's agency fee earning potential in high regard, nothing more.

Oh yes, nothing else.

 

[Fabio]

He could tear it up for psg. Domestically of course

 

[Frogfish]

We don't know if they're good enough though is my point, because we've barely given anyone a consistent run out.

Yes but who are we (there's little consensus between fans on half our 1st team anyway)?! The management see them day in day out (when promoted to the 1st team squad), so I think we have to trust them and not demand we actually see in competitive games.

 

[bluebell]

If Nunez pushes for a move, he should be allowed to leave but for figure higher than we paid Benfica.
I would want hight and pace, and sesko has that

 

[Frogfish]

I used the example of NAT Phillips not on ability, but on the fact klopps.only played him as much due to injury. If konate was more robust, or matip was back by Jan, quansah would have a lot less minutes. Again, not a slight on quansah ability; more on klopps reluctance to use kids

Or maybe just because Klopp wants to play the better player regardless of age?

We all know how good Matip is (most of the time when fit), we also know Konate can be world class (when not coming back from injury). So it's no surprise then that a youngster, no matter how good he is, finds himself behind them. The best he can do is learn from them every day in training so when the time comes he's got a great grounding (which I think we can see Quansah now has).

 

[Fabio]

Yes but who are we (there's little consensus between fans on half our 1st team anyway)?! The management see them day in day out (when promoted to the 1st team squad), so I think we have to trust them and not demand we actually see in competitive games.

Fair enough, but I also don't think that's enough of a reason to immediately think they're not good enough either. All my point is there's times when giving youth a chance could help. If city win the league, is it because they brought Bobb on against Newcastle, who made that run? We always harken back to fucking macheda as well. All my gripe is down to an inflexibility and reluctance.

 

[Fabio]

Or maybe just because Klopp wants to play the better player regardless of age?

We all know how good Matip is (most of the time when fit), we also know Konate can be world class (when not coming back from injury). So it's no surprise then that a youngster, no matter how good he is, finds himself behind them. The best he can do is learn from them every day in training so when the time comes he's got a great grounding (which I think we can see Quansah now has).

Then how do players develop? First team and playing against different opposition is much better development than training matches. Loan them out for the minutes

 

[Frogfish]

Here is Klopp acknowledging the kids, even going as far to say they showed up. Which brings me back to my original point that he hasn’t really given them the opportunity to show up again despite some first teamers not showing up.

But again - you weren't there in training which may be an influencing factor that we as fans are totally unaware of. Being exceptional in a one-off match doesn't mean you should be starting, or even getting minutes ahead of a much more (and likely more talented when on form) player. Those experienced players also need to be played themselves back into form (when out of it) and they won't do that if they sit on the bench whilst youngsters gain 'valuable minutes'.

 

[Frogfish]

Then how do players develop? First team and playing against different opposition is much better development than training matches. Loan them out for the minutes

Well that's the Catch 22 but the priority is always to win games. Everything else must be done to promote that ... e.g. bringing on a 'returning-from-injury' player ahead of a youngster or just to give de facto squad players more pitch time (we can't give youngsters minutes ahead of those players unless they on the verge of that breakthrough).

Loans are hit and miss, however we can't loan out players (even youngsters) if it may impact the team (e.g. loaning out Quansah when we're then caught short of CBs due to injury). Difficult balancing act for both club and player.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Really do not want Nunez sold. So I guess that means most do now ha.

He’s made a huge stride forward this season and has earned another season under the new coach imo.

 

[Fabio]

But again - you weren't there in training which may be an influencing factor that we as fans are totally unaware of. Being exceptional in a one-off match doesn't mean you should be starting, or even getting minutes ahead of a much more (and likely more talented when on form) player. Those experienced players also need to be played themselves back into form (when out of it) and they won't do that if they sit on the bench whilst youngsters gain 'valuable minutes'.

Oh I appreciate that training attitude absolutely will colour the views of the manager, as they should. We've seen carvalho get bombed out on loan and dropped out of squads because of it. But clearly the talent is there. It's about cultivating that for me, and channeling it.

It's all guesswork; but I think if the players performed well enough in training to get on the bench, then they're surely good enough to get a few minutes on the pitch. Otherwise what's the point?

 

[Hansern]

Really do not want Nunez sold. So I guess that means most do now ha.

He’s made a huge stride forward this season and has earned another season under the new coach imo.

No, I kind of agree. I dont think its a must to sell him. If anything I think Diaz is quite likely to leave, so a Darwin sale isnt that high up on the list. Its more if a big offer comes in then we have to consider it.