The Gravy Train 2

[Frogfish]

No Gravy thread so as I've just seen these stats I think it's probably worth starting a new one (and the title so good I had to reprise it)..

I also found this funny (sorry Fabs - nothing personal I just saw this when looking for a Gravy thread) but from 2024 TBF :

Hes fucking shite. I love being reactionary (as it's fun), but this cunt has shown fucking nothing since we signed him. Clearly there's a reason he didn't get minutes in Germany, and I think we're discovering it now. He won't be here in 2 years; providing we can find some sucker to buy him

For me, it's a fucking massive derailment. 42 dead. 136 injured. Thoughts and prayers

 

[Modo]

Talk about outing people, sheesh...


Also 🤣🤣🤣

 

[mom]

Wonder how many will regret writing off Wirtz after less than five full games

 

[Mamma Mia]

Wonder how many will regret writing off Wirtz after less than five full games

Zero. They will have moved on to the next complaint like this never happened.

 

[mark1975]

Well he wasn't the only one in that thread and it was warranted, he'd been bad for a while, was terrible in the Arsenal game that prompted that thread, and his body language was stinking the place out and doing him no favours. But yes, people should learn, as I said in that thread, other players went through similarly bad starts and came good, like Gini.

It was a bit different with Gravenberch though, he didn't look happy or motivated. You can't really say the same about Wirtz.

 

[Gerry_A_Trick]

Wonder how many will regret writing off Wirtz after less than five full games

How many actually have written him off, one maybe two?

 

[MomoWASright]

Well he wasn't the only one in that thread and it was warranted, he'd been bad for a while, was terrible in the Arsenal game that prompted that thread, and his body language was stinking the place out and doing him no favours. But yes, people should learn, as I said in that thread, other players went through similarly bad starts and came good, like Gini.

It was a bit different with Gravenberch though, he didn't look happy or motivated. You can't really say the same about Wirtz.

He had also effectively missed out on a year’s football and came to us with zero preseason. When he was getting fit he got injured or never got a run of games.

 

[mark1975]

He had also effectively missed out on a year’s football and came to us with zero preseason. When he was getting fit he got injured or never got a run of games.

Fair enough, but his body language wasn't great either, he was sulking around the pitch and he wasn't playing well at all. Contrast that with how he looks under Slot, he's super happy.

 

[mark1975]

How many actually have written him off, one maybe two?

And the rest.

 

[Gerry_A_Trick]

And the rest.

I may have missed them, but I think sometimes people mistake criticism, or wanting more, for something stronger than that.

 

[Modo]

Two people should be credited for Gravy's development, Slot and Heitinga.
The latter knew Gravenberch from his days working for Ajax's youth set up.

About Heitinga:
“He was a coach who spent a lot of time with me. I had doubts about my defensive game, but he helped me work through it—watching footage, explaining what was expected. He was really involved.”

About Slot:
It’s the coach that gives me the confidence. He’s very clear. What comes to his mind, he tells you. And also the tactical part is really good.”


Let's be honest, Klopp did a lot of things right, but he definitely mis-judged Gravenberch.


More here:

Ryan Gravenberch on honest feedback, Heitinga influence and 'something special' aim - Liverpool FC

Ryan Gravenberch is relishing an impressive second season at Liverpool that he is determined to end with ‘something special’.

www.liverpoolfc.com

 

[Markeh]

needs a contract extension asap

 

[keniget]

Let's be honest, Klopp did a lot of things right, but he definitely mis-judged Gravenberch.

I think it's hard to say. Klopp had to work with a new midfield in his last year.

Slot got Gravenberch who'd already had a year to acclimatize after not getting much game time at Bayern as well as Macca and Szobo with a year under their belts.

Slot deserves a lot of credit for what he's done but I wouldn't use it as a stick to beat Klopp with.

 

[MomoWASright]

needs a contract extension asap

We need to build his statue now. The price of materials will only go up.

 

[Fabio]

No Gravy thread so as I've just seen these stats I think it's probably worth starting a new one (and the title so good I had to reprise it)..

I also found this funny (sorry Fabs - nothing personal I just saw this when looking for a Gravy thread) but from 2024 TBF :

I regret nothing. He was shite under klopp

 

[moron]

Wonder how many will regret writing off Wirtz after less than five full games

Not me, I never wanted him

 

[tombrown]

I regret nothing. He was shite under klopp

You are a professor of dreamie

 

[mom]

How many actually have written him off, one maybe two?

Honestly, I’ve not counted, but it feels like a fair few.
If folk aren’t writing him off, then surely that means that folks expect him to get there. In which case, why the excessive criticism? Critique, sure, but for it be meaningful critique, there needs to be context.

 

[Gerry_A_Trick]

Honestly, I’ve not counted, but it feels like a fair few.
If folk aren’t writing him off, then surely that means that folks expect him to get there. In which case, why the excessive criticism? Critique, sure, but for it be meaningful critique, there needs to be context.

I think there's another level between writing him off, and expecting him to get there. I hope he'll get there, I've seen some signs that he might, but I don't believe it's a certainty. He's certainly worth putting a lot of time into and having allowances for, and that may mean not playing him all the time, whatever way Arne things is the best way to get him there, but he's currently a long way from the other midfielders, and I think we all hoped he'd be a step above them, at some point. I don't know if the right way to get him there, is to play him in a different position for a bit, play him less, or just get him to continue playing through it, all of them are options and I'll trust Arne to figure that one out.

At the minute, we're fortunate we don't need him to perform, but if we did, we'd not be in a great position. If results weren't going our way, there'd be a serious shout for him not to start until we have more confidence he'll contribute to us winning. I think its ok to voice concerns and not gloss over it, I mean what are we doing on a forum if you don't use it to discuss?

The only people I've seen write him off is DB, who does it in his own way to prove himself correct. Then moron. .. and then some new poster (or maybe infrequent, wasn't sure which) who I don't know enough about. I think everyone else, unless I missed someone, thinks or hopes he'll get there.

 

[BishBashBosh]

I think it's hard to say. Klopp had to work with a new midfield in his last year.

Slot got Gravenberch who'd already had a year to acclimatize after not getting much game time at Bayern as well as Macca and Szobo with a year under their belts.

Slot deserves a lot of credit for what he's done but I wouldn't use it as a stick to beat Klopp with.

Also don’t forget in Jurgens latter years , he delegated quite a lot of the tactical development and coaching to Pep Lijnders.

 

[peterhague]

Honestly, I’ve not counted, but it feels like a fair few.
If folk aren’t writing him off, then surely that means that folks expect him to get there. In which case, why the excessive criticism? Critique, sure, but for it be meaningful critique, there needs to be context.

Writing him off means 0% chance of success. You can still expect him to fail without writing him off.

 

[FreshRed]

Also don’t forget in Jurgens latter years , he delegated quite a lot of the tactical development and coaching to Pep Lijnders.

When we bought Gravy, Klopp did say that he thought he could play DM, but then never tried that. So, he seems to have seen that potential, but just didn’t get there yet.

 

[Squiggles]

Let's not forget that Klopp signed the guy and we're reaping the benefit. Grav was a mixed bag under Klopp, but he didn't share Klopps love of high intensity pressing off the ball. He only looked interested when we had the ball and anything else was a chore.