• You may have to login or register before you can post and view our exclusive members only forums.
    To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Trent, Salah and VVD

That's hyperbole. Find me a post where someone downplayed salahs finish. You won't. Szob got criticism because he kept breaking down attacks...as you've alluded to. No one really questioned his work rate

The Trent discussion I don't entirely get though. Attacking wise he didn't do...anything really. Though that could be down to the fact a lot of his attacking "help" was szob. You're completely ignoring his abandonment of defensive duties, which is where a wealth of the criticism is coming from.

Just seems like you're ignoring the valid criticisms of players, just to moan about the site, and I don't get that.

We did well yesterday in a difficult game; that doesn't mean every perfect was 10/10 in attack and defence
Was asking if he was that bad? I only saw the highlights. It's a valid question, if I get my football purely from here then it would be a negative limited short sighted snippets. so yes it is hyperbole. Only part of your post I can agree with. I saw the full first half and though Trent was ok and so were the rest. Bournmouth and Kerkhez seem to really have us busy on the right. Valid criticisms? In your view, I would say OTT for most part on some players on here in my view. Not sure why you are taking this so personally.

So many positives from yesterday on overall context is where I would like to focus on.
If you are expecting 10/10 in Feb with where we are then it's unreasonable I would say, at this stage of the season is about keeping it going and hopefully keeping players with something in the tank for me.
 
OMG !!!! @rubans - are you really moaning about this site ? Don't think that accusation has ever been made against any forum member.
LOL, such a bunch of sensitive souls on here. How dare I try and get a balance viewpoint post game, only partial view to others....
 
LOL, such a bunch of sensitive souls on here. How dare I try and get a balance viewpoint post game, only partial view to others....

I only read the highlights of your posts, but I want to be righteously indignant!

Actually, deep breath, let's actually talk about Trent.

Trent is a scouser and at prime age and yet of the three big contracts, people aren't as arsed about his. He got injured yesterday, and I didn't like it a bit, but mostly because now we have only one right back and a mess of games to come. I didn't think "this is an unmitigated disaster" as I would have if it was one of the other two.

So why is that?

It's because Trent isn't as useful a footballer as either of them, but a country mile, in a game that is defined by being physically competitive. Every single right back in world football playing our system would have issues playing how we play vs how Bournemouth do. We have to provide cover to defend counterattacks by rotating midfielders over, and Salah usually ends up attacks one of the most if not the advanced player. If we dont hold possession, it's a real stress test. Honestly, it'd make sense for most teams to sub a right back on 70 given how the game went, just for fresh legs. Yes, he did offer some interesting ideas and more passing range down the right at times. The thing is, it wasn't that sort of game. That's the big context.

So sure, sometimes Trent needs to be uncommitted when there's a man over. I've been very sympathetic for him in this situation with klopp. We were run at repeatedly down that side and it wasn't Trent's fault, but it also repeatedly exposed his weakness.

The thing with Trent is if you watch the people covering for him, who do put the tackle in, they are more energetic, more lethal, and here's, the huge thing, more competitive. If konate doesn't win a duel, it looks like he's tried as hard as fucking possible, and then it looks like he's livid. Its not just his side either, or defenders. If Diaz fucks up, he will go into junk yard dog mode for 10 seconds, even though he isn't really in his preferred postion. If Trent doesn't win a duel, his body language and application, are like, well, someone else will fix this, and then they do, or as with united, they don't. Sometimes vvd is accused of being too casual. He lost a duel in this game and I was flabbergasted. That's the difference. You can be casual if you're great.

Trent has never been a remarkable individual defender, but his heart doesn't seem in it now, and we are in a title run. He's feeling typecast, and we are in a title run. If he was doing his very best all the time and personally invested entirely and focused completely, id be fine with him getting beat. As I said, every right back will against Bournemouth.

Not against united though.

Is he playing like he's trying to win us back two points? Even if he did, you know what that would look like. Raking balls, crosses, and on his day the best in the game. Would it be the burst of applied defending we saw for the first handful of games this season? No.

So no, not a good game from Trent. Not worthy of pillorying him, but that's not happening because of this game.
 
I only read the highlights of your posts, but I want to be righteously indignant!

Actually, deep breath, let's actually talk about Trent.

Trent is a scouser and at prime age and yet of the three big contracts, people aren't as arsed about his. He got injured yesterday, and I didn't like it a bit, but mostly because now we have only one right back and a mess of games to come. I didn't think "this is an unmitigated disaster" as I would have if it was one of the other two.

So why is that?

It's because Trent isn't as useful a footballer as either of them, but a country mile, in a game that is defined by being physically competitive. Every single right back in world football playing our system would have issues playing how we play vs how Bournemouth do. We have to provide cover to defend counterattacks by rotating midfielders over, and Salah usually ends up attacks one of the most if not the advanced player. If we dont hold possession, it's a real stress test. Honestly, it'd make sense for most teams to sub a right back on 70 given how the game went, just for fresh legs. Yes, he did offer some interesting ideas and more passing range down the right at times. The thing is, it wasn't that sort of game. That's the big context.

So sure, sometimes Trent needs to be uncommitted when there's a man over. I've been very sympathetic for him in this situation with klopp. We were run at repeatedly down that side and it wasn't Trent's fault, but it also repeatedly exposed his weakness.

The thing with Trent is if you watch the people covering for him, who do put the tackle in, they are more energetic, more lethal, and here's, the huge thing, more competitive. If konate doesn't win a duel, it looks like he's tried as hard as fucking possible, and then it looks like he's livid. Its not just his side either, or defenders. If Diaz fucks up, he will go into junk yard dog mode for 10 seconds, even though he isn't really in his preferred postion. If Trent doesn't win a duel, his body language and application, are like, well, someone else will fix this, and then they do, or as with united, they don't. Sometimes vvd is accused of being too casual. He lost a duel in this game and I was flabbergasted. That's the difference. You can be casual if you're great.

Trent has never been a remarkable individual defender, but his heart doesn't seem in it now, and we are in a title run. He's feeling typecast, and we are in a title run. If he was doing his very best all the time and personally invested entirely and focused completely, id be fine with him getting beat. As I said, every right back will against Bournemouth.

Not against united though.

Is he playing like he's trying to win us back two points? Even if he did, you know what that would look like. Raking balls, crosses, and on his day the best in the game. Would it be the burst of applied defending we saw for the first handful of games this season? No.

So no, not a good game from Trent. Not worthy of pillorying him, but that's not happening because of this game.
Yeah I think that's fair,in line with what I have seen previously.


He seems to be playing within himself at times, even in attacking 3rd. When he does apply himself at Brentford, he is so capable of being an extra dimension on the by line. Looks like a player who isn't fully pushing himself in 2nd half of the season. Is he protecting himself for his RM move?
 
The Trent debate just carries on. We really need to ask ourselves what do we want from an RB ? All the so called great RB's and LB' from RM and Barca have in most cases been shit defensively like really shit because they have been asked to support the attack. Trent seems to put in excessive effort to defend because we all know he dont like to defend.

Then we see the apathy in his whole attitude when things go wrong and most of our goals conceded without doubt has been dissproportonally from this side. So balance that out with his other qualities and then the only conclusion that you can come to is that he is not worth it.
 
The Trent debate just carries on. We really need to ask ourselves what do we want from an RB ? All the so called great RB's and LB' from RM and Barca have in most cases been shit defensively like really shit because they have been asked to support the attack. Trent seems to put in excessive effort to defend because we all know he dont like to defend.

Then we see the apathy in his whole attitude when things go wrong and most of our goals conceded without doubt has been dissproportonally from this side. So balance that out with his other qualities and then the only conclusion that you can come to is that he is not worth it.
I sincerely hope Bradley takes his spot during the time he's out, just like when Trent ousted Clyne.
 
Bradley will need a run of games but don't think he will though. Would imagine it will be a summer signing that will come in to get a chance.
 
Don’t think he is under rated as such, he needs to start few games in a row and show he can perform as a starter. One is staying fit prior and he was outstanding against Real and was building up form and next is when he gets to start now, seize the moment. He wasn’t great against PSV or Spurs when he got his chance. He needs to start performing as I haven’t seem that consistently since he got injured after his brilliant into in Jan last year.
 
I think talks will resume when the season ends.
Hence why nothing is happening.
Van Dijk will sign. I'm certain of it. Dutch staff, Dutch players, I think he's good.
Not sure about Salah.
Trent will go.
 
I'm not sure any of them will want it left until the end of the season, I'd assume all parties will want it done, one way or another, well before then.
 
I think talks will resume when the season ends.
Hence why nothing is happening.
Van Dijk will sign. I'm certain of it. Dutch staff, Dutch players, I think he's good.
Not sure about Salah.
Trent will go.
If Trent is definitely going why didnt he sing a pre contract in January? The fact he didnt suggests to me it is not 100% definite yet
 
Mo and Virgil will sign because they won’t get this level of cash without going to Saudi. They’ll accept the more bonus driven contract. Win shit and get paid n
 
I'll cherish Trent’s brilliance on the ball, it's often a joy to way. His strike against Newcastle was the cleanest I’ve ever seen live and some of his passing is outrageous But I’m done watching him defend and play in general. It looked like he’d turned a corner when Slot first arrived, keeping it up for four or five weeks, but that’s long gone. The United performance, the sulking on the bench, the regular anger and frustration from his teammates—all while being Vice-Captain—it’s inexcusable.

He’s not even that important in Slot’s system. We saw the best of Trent when he was bombing up and down the flanks, linking with Robertson, firing in crosses, and breaking assist records. But we’re not that team anymore. The creativity comes from elsewhere, and what we’re left with is a caricature of a footballer that has dented or lost the respect and patience of many fans for understandable and valid reasons. Some of that is harsh and maybe over stated, but I'm convinced all fans would much trade 30 percent of his talent for 30% more desire, willingness to learn and attitude.

They'll be no ill-feeling if/when he goes to Madrid from me, but I'm not fearful of it. It's an opportunity for Slot/Hughes to mould the first team into a clearer idea of what he wants. The reality is we need Konate to cover Trent, and Konate himself is injury prone, so having a more well-rounded player alongside Bradley can ensure we're less targeted down one side and generally more solid. The upcoming challenge for Slot will be to ensure there's enough creativity and chance creation within the starting eleven to compensate for his absence. We've yet to see Slots and Hughes squad building ability at Liverpool so this will be one of the first major tests. There's more creativity to be unlocked from both Mac Allister and Szobo and a stable/fit/decent number 9 will help our build up and general chemistry on the ball, which will help.
 
I'll cherish Trent’s brilliance on the ball—at times, it’s truly a joy to watch. His strike against Newcastle was the cleanest I’ve ever seen live.

But I’m done watching him defend and play in general. It looked like he’d turned a corner when Slot first arrived, keeping it up for four or five weeks, but that’s long gone. The United performance, the sulking on the bench, the regular anger and frustration from his teammates—all while being Vice-Captain—it’s inexcusable.

He’s not even that important in Slot’s system. We saw the best of Trent when he was bombing up and down the flanks, linking with Robertson, firing in crosses, and breaking assist records. But we’re not that team anymore. The creativity comes from elsewhere, and what we’re left with is a caricature of a footballer that has dented or lost the respect and patience of many fans for understandable and valid reasons. Some of that is harsh and maybe over stated, but I'm convinced all fans would much trade 30 percent of his talent for 50% more desire, willingness to learn and attitude. They'll be no ill-feeling if/when he goes to Madrid, but I'm not fearful of it. It's an opportunity for Slot/Hughes to mould the first team into a clearer idea of what he wants.

The reality is we need Konate to cover Trent, and Konate himself is injury prone, so having a more well-rounded player alongside Bradley can ensure we're less targeted down one side and generally more solid. The upcoming challenge for Slot will be to ensure there's enough creativity and chance creation within the reason of the starting eleven to compensate for his absence. We've yet to see Slots and Hughes squad building ability at Liverpool so this will be a first major test .
Gravy was more of right back against Bournemouth than Trent was.
 
Mo. and Virgil will sign. Trent I hope goes. I want a proper RB not a maverick wanna be prima donna. I could be persuaded otherwise if there were real signs of Slot improving him - but there aren't and his attitude stinks (on the pitch).

If it's Bradley + A.N.Other I'd be delighted. That said why on earth would Real want TAA?
 
I sincerely hope Bradley takes his spot during the time he's out, just like when Trent ousted Clyne.
I was hoping we could talk about the defence, but my post got people triggered. We didn't get peronnel in to strengthen the back the Klopp will have to use the resources he has at hand.
Not sure why Trent has issues getting back and defending and the Man U game, Slot tried to deflect the blame on to other players. The reality is we aren't getting the output from him to justify the gaps he leaves. He is a luxury player whose best role is in RM but our system does not allow for a RM.
Bradley has had some very forgettable appearances, but with time could get better. We know Gomez is a better defending RB (than CB and TAA) but cannot whip the ball in - I am okay with that. As long as we aren't getting raped on out right handside, I would like to see Gomez there.
 
I was hoping we could talk about the defence, but my post got people triggered. We didn't get peronnel in to strengthen the back the Klopp will have to use the resources he has at hand.
Not sure why Trent has issues getting back and defending and the Man U game, Slot tried to deflect the blame on to other players. The reality is we aren't getting the output from him to justify the gaps he leaves. He is a luxury player whose best role is in RM but our system does not allow for a RM.
Bradley has had some very forgettable appearances, but with time could get better. We know Gomez is a better defending RB (than CB and TAA) but cannot whip the ball in - I am okay with that. As long as we aren't getting raped on out right handside, I would like to see Gomez there.
Imagine us playing in a CL semi-final against Real with having this version of Trent play against Vinicius/Mbappe.
 
Imagine us playing in a CL semi-final against Real with having this version of Trent play against Vinicius/Mbappe.
If he has in his mind to go to madrid, then we are playing someone that could have dual loyalty.... Also, we've seen before how easily gets turned over.
Ancelotti is complaining he has no CBs so they may get knocked out by City
 
If he has in his mind to go to madrid, then we are playing someone that could have dual loyalty.... Also, we've seen before how easily gets turned over.
Ancelotti is complaining he has no CBs so they may get knocked out by City
Great ... the NO CB team against the NO Midfield with legs team. This should be fun.
 
Back
Top Bottom