West Ham v Liverpool Post Match
- Thread starter Mors
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
- Status
We're such a strange strange team...who'd have thought we'd go to Stoke West Brom Watford and West Ham and get 4 wins on the bounce, only conceding 1 goal with 3 of the 4 games being us grinding it out for the win Rafa like away in Europe ...usually places where we'd come unstuck as well.
Fair play we've shown a set of balls at key moments.
Fair play we've shown a set of balls at key moments.
Really? I thought it would be our easiest game of the run in and so it proved
Some thoughts:
- Can was superb. Unlike many, I don't think Klopp's buying a DM this summer. I don't quite see the clamour for one either. Can's turning into a very very good footballer, and Henderson's more than capable there.
- That said, if the opposition's shit, then DM's always look good in a diamond midfield because they've got options forward of them. Three midfielders and two strikers to play forward to. The problem with a flat 3, especially our really fucking flat 3 is that they can only give sideways half the time.
- Fair balls to Klopp for going with a diamond for the first time all season - in his most important match he's managed for us. Takes some cojones (or whatever the german is for that) to shift it up like that. Could have seriously backfired.
- I think he went for it cos he knew he had nothing attacking-wise on the bench. Woodburn and Gurjic aren't stars to turn to, so he put his best side out and hoped the match would be done inside 70 mins. Which it was.
- Big game performance from Coutinho. Influenced from deep, scored 2 fucking belters and pretty much won the game for us on his own. You can't argue with his talent, it's just whether he really fucking wants to be the best player on the pitch for me, and today he brought it. Huge performance.
- Beat Middlesboro - which we will do comfortably by the way - on Sunday and we've got 76 points for the season. Mahrez scores from the fucking spot at the weekend, and we'd have been in 3rd cunting place, but anyway. Here's the rub of it; our squad is shite. Look at the state of our bench today. Look at it any fucking week and it's replete with blokes who just shouldn't be there - Klavan, Grujic, etc - and children (Woodburn, TAA). Even his starting 11 has blokes like Milner, Lucas, Mignolet, Origi, Lovren, etc in it, who and let's face it - wouldn't get a game in any of our rivals 11's. He's had Mane out for a quarter of the year, Coutinho too, Sturridge out for 80% of it, Lallana missing 10 games, his captain gone for half the year, and an unsettled central defensive pairing. He's going to make top 4 with that bunch of reprobates too. Not a single person on here wouldn't have been delighted with that if they were offered it at the start of the year. Sure, he mightn't make substitutions early enough, and sure he gets carried away - but who would you swop him for? 4-0 away with an untried formation in the biggest game of the year. He's pretty fucking good is Klopp.
The season beautifully put into perspective .
Ballacks isn't it?
Indeed - what we witnessed today is that both Coutinhio and Studge are a class apart from the rest of the players.
Each seemed to know how to take on the opposition, and the movement from both was brilliant. What I really hated in that game was most of the first half apart from the goal - it was systemic of our failures in the games post Christmas that has put us in this position. I know there is a massive love-in for Clyne on this site but I really wanted to smash the TV everytime he got the ball in that first half - you just knew he was going to pass backwards - yet we could see so many gaps where players could run into against that West Ham defense. It was only Studge, and Coutinhio who wanted to move that ball forward with pace whenever possible - most of the games we have lost or drawn have been because we have labored backwards and sideways - sometimes to break up the deep lying opposition it maybe better to force them to come out by taking them on directly like Studge was doing. We had two players who were willing to go 1 on 1 (toe to toe) with the opposition today - that's why we won.
We may need to switch off the targeting and use the "Studge" against Dark Boro.
Forget the talent, ability, game-changing skill... Here's the two major facts worth talking about:
1. He has missed more games for us than he has played in his time with us.
2. In his last 3 seasons, he has scored 5 goals, 13 goals, and 7 goals (to date this season) TOTAL.
Those are unarguable. I get he's fucking quality, but even if he is fit at the start of next season (and there's statistically more chance of that not happening) then he'll be a 28 year old striker, who's lost a yard or three of pace.
We simply cannot rely on him.
The best situation possible would be for him to score another goal (or two) on Sunday. That combined with today adds another 10M to his value, and we sell. We could get 30-40M for him. which would be incredible for a guy that's averaged 8 total goals over his last 3 seasons.
Sell him.
Hard to argue with that.
Brilliant result, now let's twat Boro.
As for Sturridge, we have these debates every time he's out for months then he comes back, looks quality and scores. Look, no-one doubts his talent, he's England's #1 (well, maybe #2) striker when he's fit. But we know he's rarely fit. And he's on 150k a week.
Unfortunately it's a no-brainer.
As for Sturridge, we have these debates every time he's out for months then he comes back, looks quality and scores. Look, no-one doubts his talent, he's England's #1 (well, maybe #2) striker when he's fit. But we know he's rarely fit. And he's on 150k a week.
Unfortunately it's a no-brainer.
Haven't seen the game yet but great result. Thought for sure that we would slip up.
Unfortunately, I have to agree.
I'm not the only one who thinks that even fully fit, he is a diminished player physically.
Yeah, he's still twice the player Origi will ever be, and is a far more gifted finisher than Firmino, but that's not hard.
We need at least one new striker, whether he stays or goes
Another point on Sturridge...
I think Klopp's concern with even a fully fit Sturridge is that he seems to only fit in a front 2 these days. He's had several games as the 9 in a 4-3-3 this year, and looked really poor. Little defensive output, little offensive threat, low on energy. His best games for us came when Brodge stuck him and Suarez togethor and played them as wide forwards in a diamond 4-4-2 where they could run from out to in. Suarez did the yards for the two of them, and Sturridge bagged plenty. In the 5 seasons he's had with us, it's the only time he's score more than 13 goals in a year.
Same yesterday with Origi and him wide. Immediately Sturridge loses 50% of his responsibility to 'work', cos Origi's there to share the load. He doesn't half to drop deep to collect, can play side-on to goal rather than have his back to it, and isn't receiving it with a centre half up his arse.
The darting run he made for the goal, and the quasi-assist for our 4th goal all came from him attacking in from wide right onto his favoured left.
He wouldn't get any of that in Klopp's favoured 4-3-3.
I think Klopp's concern with even a fully fit Sturridge is that he seems to only fit in a front 2 these days. He's had several games as the 9 in a 4-3-3 this year, and looked really poor. Little defensive output, little offensive threat, low on energy. His best games for us came when Brodge stuck him and Suarez togethor and played them as wide forwards in a diamond 4-4-2 where they could run from out to in. Suarez did the yards for the two of them, and Sturridge bagged plenty. In the 5 seasons he's had with us, it's the only time he's score more than 13 goals in a year.
Same yesterday with Origi and him wide. Immediately Sturridge loses 50% of his responsibility to 'work', cos Origi's there to share the load. He doesn't half to drop deep to collect, can play side-on to goal rather than have his back to it, and isn't receiving it with a centre half up his arse.
The darting run he made for the goal, and the quasi-assist for our 4th goal all came from him attacking in from wide right onto his favoured left.
He wouldn't get any of that in Klopp's favoured 4-3-3.
Last edited:
Spot on. This is why I dont rate Origi massively or think he's our long term solution.
It's also why Brendan & I, plus a few others, have been SCREAMING for a striker. Those balls across the box are commonplace when we play, & usually they fucking sail from one side to the other, again & again. Yet a striker will anticipate that & try to bang it in. That equals more goals, more time ahead in games, & defenders trying to be in two places at once, & in two minds about where to position themselves, which gives other players more room.
Their defence also drops back more often, you see defenders run to the goal line when playing Chelsea, City & Utd to try to block a shot cos they know a striker will make that type of run. This means the rest of our players can push up.
We have all watched us this season, we push up with the ball, then get around the box & their defenders simply hold the line. We play the ball across & it goes out of play, we pass it round & the just hold that fucking line.
You play the ball across or get in the position to, when you have a striker regularly doing that, & their defenders have to drop back further to try to negate that, which means our other players can then get further forward. When that includes Lallana, Coutinho etc, that means we're gonna fucking score at some point.
I am starting to think that Origi could perhaps get a decent career in a (bottom-half) team that is first and foremost defending as he is then offered much more time and space on the ball (counter-attack style) than with us.
We should try and cash in on him come Summer, as I simply can't see him play as a regular for a title-aspiring team like ourselves (in the upcoming Seasons) and I don't think he'd be of much used as an impact sub. He simply doesn't seem to have the acquired game-intelligence nor flair to make the grade at Anfield.
We should try and cash in on him come Summer, as I simply can't see him play as a regular for a title-aspiring team like ourselves (in the upcoming Seasons) and I don't think he'd be of much used as an impact sub. He simply doesn't seem to have the acquired game-intelligence nor flair to make the grade at Anfield.
Big time. Origi is closer to the goal when Milner hits it, so if he makes the same run he has a tap in.
Apropos West Ham, by the way - wasn't that the weirdest performance of the season? Not just listless and witless but at times plain mad. I had the sound down because Carra's non-stop moaning was getting on my nerves, so when their penalty appeal was dismissed and we went up the other end to score, I just assumed that the ref had whistled for something because hardly any West Ham players were even running and chasing as Coutinho pondered when and where to shoot. Incredibly amateurish. There were several more occasions when most of them just switched off completely. Which makes it really hard to gauge how we'll perform next weekend against Boro. I guess the goals will boost confidence, but that was a very strange game.
I expect similar from Everton in their game against Arsenal next week
- Status
Similar threads
-
- Locked
