The curious case of the RB who thought he was a CM

[rurikbird]

Some would say our teething problems comes from doing a midfield rebuild during the season.
Being top of the league when things arent working is quite the achievement.

I agree with that. There was also a bit of luck with how the early games we played with 10 men galvanized the squad and brought them together quicker than it would normally happen with new signings, but we made that luck ourselves. You can see Klopp is genuinely happy with our new “leadership group.” The squad cohesion has outpaced tactical cohesion this season.

 

[Hansern]

I agree with that. There was also a bit of luck with how the early games we played with 10 men galvanized the squad and brought them together quicker than it would normally happen with new signings, but we made that luck ourselves. You can see Klopp is genuinely happy with our new “leadership group.” The squad cohesion has outpaced tactical cohesion this season.

Agreed, and I’m also a bit surprised by the fact that our defensive side of the game so far doesnt get enough credit. For a team that is supposed to be to open we’ve conceded the fewest goals and has the third best expected goals conceded stats.

 

[King Binny]

 

[LarryHagman]

Football 1.01 - who's your best player - Trent.

Give him the fucking ball.

 

[binomial]

Football 1.01 - who's your best player - Trent.

Give him the fucking ball.

We do give him the ball, an awful lot of the time actually but for every bit of brilliance he pulls out he also gives away an awful lot, I think he along with Mo have the lowest pass accuracy in the team.

Our best player? No. That would be either Ali or Virgil....for sure he can pass the ball like very few can (in his generation at least) but he also needs to work on his robustness off the ball.

 

[rurikbird]

 

[moron]

Agreed, and I’m also a bit surprised by the fact that our defensive side of the game so far doesnt get enough credit. For a team that is supposed to be to open we’ve conceded the fewest goals and has the third best expected goals conceded stats.

I think the issue is statistics show we concede big chances , but two factors have played into our favour:

1) Alisson
2) The opposition dont take their clear chances very well.

 

[tombrown]

I think the issue is statistics show we concede big chances , but two factors have played into our favour:

1) Alisson
2) The opposition dont take their clear chances very well.

1 begets 2; opposition don't convert their chances as they know they have to put it in the top corner to beat the best keeper in the world, and, more often than not, fail as a result.

 

[King Binny]

 

[LarryHagman]

Our best player? No. That would be either Ali or Virgil....for sure he can pass the ball like very few can (in his generation at least) but he also needs to work on his robustness off the ball.

You're watching a different game to me. Like when Gerrard was accused of Hollywood passes. He's our best player by a country mile.

 

[binomial]

You're watching a different game to me. Like when Gerrard was accused of Hollywood passes. He's our best player by a country mile.

If he was our "best player by a country mile", then he'd have the LFC player of the season award....he'd have more LFC MOTM awards than anyone else. Does he? No.

 

[LarryHagman]

Lucas used to win that.

 

[binomial]

Lucas used to win that.

Yep, once in 10 years when we had the likes of Stewie, Konchesky and Carroll at the club.

Hyppia, Suarez, Gerrard, Salah, Virgil, Sadio, Coutinho, Oh and Ali have also won that.

If you believe him to be our best player by a country mile, then why hasn't he had the majority of the votes in any of the last 5-6 seasons? Why hasn't he been voted LFC's player of the match more often than the likes of Ali, Salah, Virgil or even Szobo?

 

[Dreambeliever]

You're watching a different game to me. Like when Gerrard was accused of Hollywood passes. He's our best player by a country mile.

He’s not. He has the potential to be but he’s not right now. Nevermind by a country mile.

 

[KopRed]

Football 1.01 - who's your best player - Trent.

Give him the fucking ball.

He needs to play it like he used to instead of trying to dribble it. Losing the ball in the areas he is usually in means we are scrambling back.

 

[Woland]

It's kinda subjective but I think yall know what Larry means. Other players like VVD and Ali may be very talented too but they're not going to turn a game round in the way TAA has the potential to. Who else does? Salah and Slob maybe.

 

[King Binny]

 

[Frogfish]

Interesting stat I've just seen. It's 26 games (it's from 2 weeks ago) since Trent started playing full time as an inverted FB (in the PL) and in that time :

Liverpool 61 pts
City 58 pts
Villa 52 pts
United 49 pts
Arsenal 48 pts

There is literally no arguing with that and the strongest evidence yet that we can win the PL this season. Klopp you are a genius (even though he didn't start the trend his implementation is clearly the best - or maybe it's just the players). On that last point I see Neville now states that we have 4 world class players as he's added Trent to the list (along with Ali, VvD and Mo.).

Excellent analysis from The Athletic :

 

[StevieM]

Interesting stat I've just seen. It's 26 games (it's from 2 weeks ago) since Trent started playing full time as an inverted FB (in the PL) and in that time :

Liverpool 61 pts
City 58 pts
Villa 52 pts
United 49 pts
Arsenal 48 pts

There is literally no arguing with that and the strongest evidence yet that we can win the PL this season. Klopp you are a genius (even though he didn't start the trend his implementation is clearly the best - or maybe it's just the players). On that last point I see Neville now states that we have 4 world class players as he's added Trent to the list (along with Ali, VvD and Mo.).

Excellent analysis from The Athletic :

I think that’s the video I posted a few days ago.

It should put to bed the notion that the inverted FB role is “all” about Trent or that we’re going to sign another RB and suddenly have him playing high up the wing while Trent moves into midfield full time.

I like how we’ve taken the Guardiola system and put our own spin on it to make it more effective.

The weakness of the system (lack of width) also might explain why Guardiola is supposedly shifting to having more traditional touchline hugging wingers (he doesn’t need that many goals from his wide players with that monster in the centre) - that looks like it’s designed to exploit the spaces left by inverted FB systems that are designed to overload the centre.

 

[rurikbird]

 

[LarryHagman]

It would be worth Trent leaving to prove to you cunts what we've had. The best RB in the world, a top 3 playmaker in the world.

Once we get an average RB and you try to defend that, believe me, I'll be on your case you knobheads.

He's a generational player. Klopp knows. Middle of the park for that boy.

 

[Dreambeliever]

It would be worth Trent leaving to prove to you cunts what we've had. The best RB in the world, a top 3 playmaker in the world.

Once we get an average RB and you try to defend that, believe me, I'll be on your case you knobheads.

He's a generational player. Klopp knows. Middle of the park for that boy.

He won’t leave.

 

[darkstarexodus]

It would be worth Trent leaving to prove to you cunts what we've had. The best RB in the world, a top 3 playmaker in the world.

Once we get an average RB and you try to defend that, believe me, I'll be on your case you knobheads.

He's a generational player. Klopp knows. Middle of the park for that boy.

I don't know what I think about him in midfield yet, but agree that we take him and many other players for granted.

Szob looks like he's been brainswapped with a zombie the last few weeks but has among the best progression stats in the league.

Darwin is the dullest tool in the shed but among the top three attackers for combined xG/xA in the league.

I've been a huge critic of Mo as he looks like he's running in treacle but the numbers say a different story.

I'm not convinced by how we look on the pitch most weeks but the stats show we're the most dangerous offensive team in world football.

So, I guess I'm saying that we've been spoiled a bit and as much as we all like to think we're experts, I'm glad that I'm wrong all the fucking time.

 

[binomial]

Is Ait Nouri really that low down?

Trent's always gonna shine in the passing stats, the first thing he looks for is progressive passes through the lines. It's pretty much his A game so of course no other RB will come close to him in that aspect just like he won't be close to many RB's in the defensive stats.

 

[rubans]

Is Ait Nouri really that low down?

Trent's always gonna shine in the passing stats, the first thing he looks for is progressive passes through the lines. It's pretty much his A game so of course no other RB will come close to him in that aspect just like he won't be close to many RB's in the defensive stats.

He was doing just fine on the defensive stats across against top 5 RBs last time I posted on this which was a few months ago including the “best RB in the world” Trippier.

 

[binomial]

He was doing just fine on the defensive stats across against top 5 RBs last time I posted on this which was a few months ago including the “best RB in the world” Trippier.

Well, not according to this..

https://datamb.football/T_Alexander_Arnold_Full-back_stats/

But then again we don't and never really have judged him as an out and out defender because of how gifted he is on the ball.

 

[rubans]

Well, not according to this..

https://datamb.football/T_Alexander_Arnold_Full-back_stats/

But then again we don't and never really have judged him as an out and out defender because of how gifted he is on the ball.

Wtf is that…
It’s like something one of those failed programmers nowdays called data scientists produce without any context. Prefer rank over percentiles anyday.

 

[binomial]

Wtf is that…
It’s like something one of those failed programmers nowdays called data scientists produce without any context.

It looks quite legible to me. It's from the same data website which puts Trent's passing at such an anomaly to every other RB in Europe.....you can't acknowledge one and not the other.

 

[rubans]

It looks quite legible to me. It's from the same data website which puts Trent's passing at such an anomaly to every other RB in Europe.....you can't acknowledge one and not the other.

I didn’t acknowledge either. Anyway, One is scatter graph which compares against other rbs on a few metrics and the other one is, well not sure what it’s supposed to prove…
Stats just prove what was being said earlier in the season, not how many times Doku dribbled past him.

 

[binomial]

I didn’t acknowledge either. Anyway, One is scatter graph which compares against other rbs on a few metrics and the other one is, well not sure what it’s supposed to prove…
Stats just prove what was being said earlier in the season, not how many times Doku dribbled past him.

It shows where he is in relation to other fullbacks in Europe's top 7 leagues via percentiles.....i.e one of the best in expected assists and progressive passes and pretty awful with his defensive mechanics such as interceptions/blocks/tackles/1 on 1 successes etc.

& for me the stats for Trent here is an accurate measure when you watch him play every week.