What changed ?

[Rosco]

So, a few weeks ago we were looking at not signing anyone because of financial uncertainty. Buying Werner wasn't possible because of the uncertainty.

Now we've signed the Greek Lad, Thiago and Jota.

Were we lying about the uncertainty or did our finances become more certain going forward ?

 

[Mamma Mia]

No idea, but my guess is that nothing changed. We were being rightfully cautious, and Werner wasn't the right fit due to cost and his expectations of being a guaranteed starter.

Call me an eternal optimist, but I think we just have a really good management team who make decisions based on a lot more than we are aware of.

 

[jimmy]

I read that the payment structure for Thiago and Jota are very convenient as they are spread over several years, and the down payment is rather low.
Add to this the sales of Lovren and Hoever, and the plan to sell some more fringe players, and it looks like nothing has changed.

 

[The Nomad]

Yep seems like we are buying with little or no outlay this season, but when we are selling we are also asking for cash up front.

 

[gkmacca]

The local hacks were either duped by the club, or else duped the fans on behalf of the club, because all of those 'we have absolutely no interest in Thiago' stories went on for ages, and it just insults the intelligence to suggest that a week ago the club suddenly thought Thiago was worth pursuing after all.

So what changed? From the outside, you could speculate that our pre-season performances, followed by our all-over-the-shop first game against Leeds, would certainly have helped the cause of anyone inside the club who'd been insisting that we really DID need to strengthen the squad.

One could also imagine that the club had its targets and was merely waiting until the right deals could be struck.

It's probably a combination of the two. There surely wasn't a completely coherent plan or strategy: there were simply too many claims emanating from the club early on that we'd be fine with what we've got, and the kids would come on dramatically to fill the gaps, and you just don't chase Werner for over a year if you think he (a) isn't good enough and (b) will expect to start most games. So they had plans, but they must have changed to some extent because of finances and internal debates. There surely must have been SOME cause for concern as our performances kept looking so below par - it's simply irresponsible to explain away so much.

I think the Jota signing is the biggest sign there was a fairly dramatic change in urgency if not also policy. Left back - that had been a priority for ages, and the process of picking the right-priced target began promptly. Thiago - he had also been a target for quite a while, regardless of the nonsense that the Echo kept churning out. But the Jota move? Maybe it's just because I don't know enough about him to find the signing more than mildly underwhelming, but in the past there's been such an emphasis on waiting for the player Klopp really wanted, and did he REALLY want Jota more than any other? He seems much more like the kind of 'low down the list, at least he's flexible' signing Rafa used to keep making.

 

[Fabio]

I think for the cost of jota, I don't think he was a "he'll do" kind of signing. Klopp definitely wanted him as an alternative to sarr, same as Kostas as an alternative to Lewis.

I just don't think we negotiate anymore.

I think we offer a set amount, and then haggle over how it'll be paid.

Lewis we were told 20m, so any negotiation after that could have been a nuisance if they wanted that high a figure, before we even discussed breakdown of payment.

Imagine it could be same with sarr and jota. Watford want the big bucks which he's not worth, whereas wolves wanted big bucks for a premier League proven player, but we're willing to let us pay near enough fuck all to start with.

 

[Woland]

I think the savants in the spreadsheet division must have got a minority report on Jota and it turns out he's gonna be better than Messi in two years or something

 

[Woland]

On the payment terms, it makes sense on the cashflow / balance sheet thing that wolves paid us up front for Hoever but were happy for us to pay a premium for Jota on the drip. They're a massive investment fund and obvs cashflow just isn't an issue, value is.

 

[peterhague]

I think the answer is fairly obvious: the powers that be finally listened to those of us who've been saying we need to make signings, irregardless of our financial position.

But irregardless of the reasons, I'm just glad we've got what we needed.

 

[keniget]

I'd like to think that we didn't kneejerk as a result of Leeds or any other game.

It was surely clear to everyone at the club that we need(ed) reinforcements across the board and have done for a while.

The Werner / Jota debate is an interesting one in terms of how you shift from one of Europe's premier up and coming strikers to a Wolves squad player. I guess we'll never know the details of it but if Jota proves to be a big success we won't care. Fingers crossed!

 

[Beamrider]

On the payment terms, it makes sense on the cashflow / balance sheet thing that wolves paid us up front for Hoever but were happy for us to pay a premium for Jota on the drip. They're a massive investment fund and obvs cashflow just isn't an issue, value is.

Agreed, whereas for us, it’s the other way around, cash is the key measure.

 

[Rosco]

Agreed, whereas for us, it’s the other way around, cash is the key measure.

So we must be expecting cash in the next 12 months to cover the Jota fee then.

 

[Atlas]

I don't think much changed at all, majority was speculation and followed by smoke and mirrors the VVD saga clearly hurt enough that it wasn't going to happen ever again. Re Jota I think we had something similar with Fab when he joined.

Let's just face it, LFC are a well run ship, great quality on the pitch major trophies, a great manager a huge pull for world class players. The business isde if great with solid finances. We've managed to get quality players in and sell players who were not progressing for ridiculous fees, or at the very least fair deals.

 

[Beamrider]

So we must be expecting cash in the next 12 months to cover the Jota fee then.

We won’t be paying out instalments on Alisson, Fabinho and Shaqiri this time next year (whereas I expect we will have done this year) so we’ll have capacity to pay extra on Jota and Thiago, even just with a normal level of cash flow.

 

[Woland]

Lovren was getting paid more a year than wolves are getting paid out for Jota. Stuff like that I guess.

 

[Woland]

Agreed, whereas for us, it’s the other way around, cash is the key measure.

Yeah I've given into this now. I do think they were able to stiff us on the fee because of this though.

 

[peterhague]

Yeah I've given into this now. I do think they were able to stiff us on the fee because of this though.

Defo. We've effectively whacked it all on a credit card and paying a shitload of interest.

 

[gkmacca]

I think for the cost of jota, I don't think he was a "he'll do" kind of signing. Klopp definitely wanted him as an alternative to sarr,

But did he, though? There are reports today we're also going for Sarr.

 

[Hansern]

All in all, I think nothing changed. We were interested in players, but it was down to getting the right structure of the deals given we stand to lose about 100 mill £ from Covid-19 and wanted as little outlay as possible now.

Its to shortsighted to believe a 4-3 win over Leeds prompted us to sign two players, or that we as a club would give in to demands of fans regarding transfers. The club is well run from top to bottom with a manager that knows what he wants and also now has one of the best recruitment teams.
We waited until the best deals possible emerged for us as a club, and got the targets we wanted and that were available to fit the structures set for this season financially.

Its a good example of how little the media in England know about whats happening though. We clearly have learnt from the Virgil spectacle, and aren't informing anyone about whats going on.

 

[Dreambeliever]

They obviously read your no transfers thread and thought we can finally shut that smug nugget lovin WUM up?

Clearly the most plausible reason.

 

[Fabio]

But did he, though? There are reports today we're also going for Sarr.

I'd be very surprised if we wanted sarr as well. And if we did, then surely klopp wanted both. It's often said he's a man who goes for the right player, rather than a player who will suffice. I can't imagine that changing now

We used to buy 2 or 3 10m players when we needed a 30m player. The change to buying strong in positions we need is a welcome one, and one I think klopp has personally pushed

 

[StevieM]

I’d imagine we have a list of players at different ages and price points that fit whatever criteria or metrics we’re using.

It then becomes about the structure of the deal and whether it suits us financially.

Werner & Jota seem to be good examples - the transfer fee was the overall same amount - so I can only assume the structure of payments and wages were different - and that’s what got it over the line.

Guess it’s like buying a car on HP or a house on a mortgage- the less you pay up front, the more you’ll pay overall, but the better you cashflow is.

I guess we could elect to pay it off quicker at a lower fee if conditions change.

I’d say, the things that changed were that both Wolves & Bayern accepted spread payments rather than a larger upfront payment.

It’s possible, depending on how the deals for the players we sold are structured - that if we received more up front (which is possible due to lower transfer fee) combined with the incoming player fees being spaced across a longer period - means we’ve balanced this years payments and would hope revenue bounces back in future years.

Wages probably won’t be that different due to the potentially high wages of those that have left. (Including Lallana).

 

[mwake]

I also think on a simplistic nature a lot of this comes down to The Jurgen Klopp Factor...before Klopp it was first choice or bust, or buy a second/third place out of desperation and watch them burn. But now with Klopp it's a case of if we don't get our first choice, we go for the second choice with full confidence that Super Coach Klopp will still up their attributes to excellent or world class status.

 

[HC]

What's our outlay this summer £10m or something stupid, we've spent half the summer agreeing fee structures seemingly

 

[gkmacca]

Its to shortsighted to believe a 4-3 win over Leeds prompted us to sign two players, or that we as a club would give in to demands of fans regarding transfers.

Who on earth said that?

 

[Champ]

Who on earth said that?

All along Klopp never committed a NO to Thiago signing and he is not the type that reacts to fans outcry. Last summer when fans were asking for new players he said something like he can't wait to see the transfer window close. I think he goes by his plans maybe slightly affected by payment terms and perhaps marketing motives but definitely he picks his players and signs them when its appropriate. I just hope he has seen in Jota is what he saw in Salah some years ago.

 

[Rosco]

I’d imagine we have a list of players at different ages and price points that fit whatever criteria or metrics we’re using.

It then becomes about the structure of the deal and whether it suits us financially.

Werner & Jota seem to be good examples - the transfer fee was the overall same amount - so I can only assume the structure of payments and wages were different - and that’s what got it over the line.

Guess it’s like buying a car on HP or a house on a mortgage- the less you pay up front, the more you’ll pay overall, but the better you cashflow is.

I guess we could elect to pay it off quicker at a lower fee if conditions change.

I’d say, the things that changed were that both Wolves & Bayern accepted spread payments rather than a larger upfront payment.

It’s possible, depending on how the deals for the players we sold are structured - that if we received more up front (which is possible due to lower transfer fee) combined with the incoming player fees being spaced across a longer period - means we’ve balanced this years payments and would hope revenue bounces back in future years.

Wages probably won’t be that different due to the potentially high wages of those that have left. (Including Lallana).

We know match day revenue is going to be down for the next year.

There'll be some book balancing big sale in the next 12 months.

 

[StevieM]

We know match day revenue is going to be down for the next year.

There'll be some book balancing big sale in the next 12 months.

Probably - how else will we afford Mbappe.

 

[MomoWASright]

Salah and Mané out with Mbappe and Sancho in.

 

[gkmacca]

All along Klopp never committed a NO to Thiago signing and he is not the type that reacts to fans outcry. Last summer when fans were asking for new players he said something like he can't wait to see the transfer window close. I think he goes by his plans maybe slightly affected by payment terms and perhaps marketing motives but definitely he picks his players and signs them when its appropriate. I just hope he has seen in Jota is what he saw in Salah some years ago.

What's any of that got to do with my question as to who said we only bought two players because of one game against Leeds or because of fan pressure???