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Formula 1 Thread

Button deserved it, as Andy says though, I'd like him to really push the thing occasionally though.

He's like the Lennox Lewis of F1, technically gifted but just cant get me excited.
 
[quote author=livvy185 link=topic=36232.msg965243#msg965243 date=1255906380]
I thought he was brilliant today. Overall he deserved the title.
[/quote]

Agreed. Like Brundle said in commentary I was pleased that he clinched it with a good drive.
All the begrudgers saying he is not a worthy champ haven't got much to say today, he won it in style.
I can see it being a one hit wonder though!! Alonso for the title in '10.
 
[quote author=DHSC link=topic=36232.msg965276#msg965276 date=1255914866]
Lol @ Sutil and Trulli.
[/quote]
What Sutil did wrong is beyond me.
Trulli was way OTT in his reaction.
 
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36232.msg965174#msg965174 date=1255893638]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=36232.msg965153#msg965153 date=1255890457]
Wasn't there a huge controversy at the beginning of the season over some illegal part ?
[/quote]3 teams had interpreted the rules for the rear difuser differently to the other teams.
No one complained.
The cars were miles faster than the other teams.
The other teams complained.
The fia deemed the difuser to be not only legal but an exact interpretation of the rules.
The other teams copied the design.
The title was effectively gone already with only two teams in with a chance thanks to their innovative design work.

In no way did Brawn or Red Bull or Force India cheat. As im sure you know Rosco.
Mclaren last year cheated. No arguments there. Mclaren are cunts.
[/quote]

Its certainly not cheating. But they were definitely helped by unclear ruling.

The interpretation of the rules by Honda went against the reason for the major overhaul of rules. They wanted to reduce the dirty air, to increase aero efficiency of the following car, and allow for increased overtaking.... so they made the wings narrow. The diffuser acted as a second wing which didn't help to increase the overtaking at all. The fia were daft really daft in the wording of the rule...and that was exploited by Honda/Brawn. They infact should have said no to diffusers. Now we are going to have to listen to them whine about dirty air for following car for a few more years...

The marque teams suffered this year. But kudos to them for spending so much time and effort on the KERS which may actually have some road-car relevance.
 
[quote author=Stu link=topic=36232.msg965620#msg965620 date=1255957555]
[quote author=livvy185 link=topic=36232.msg965243#msg965243 date=1255906380]
I thought he was brilliant today. Overall he deserved the title.
[/quote]

Agreed. Like Brundle said in commentary I was pleased that he clinched it with a good drive.
All the begrudgers saying he is not a worthy champ haven't got much to say today, he won it in style.
I can see it being a one hit wonder though!! Alonso for the title in '10.
[/quote]

The truth is that he drove far too conservatively in the later half. Previously, racers preserving a championship lead at least had the decency to aim for podium finishes. He went about his businesss collecting the odd points here and there. I would have really liked to see him pushed to the wire and see how he performed under pressure.

Vettel and Webber were far more deserving candidates to be crowned WDC this year compared to Jensen and Barichello.

Webber has truly woeful luck.

He is at least more deserving than Damon Hill or Villeneuve.
 
Like any other sport Max, the table doesn't lie.
The guy with the most points on the board deserves to be the champion.
 
[size=13pt]McLaren want Kimi Raikkonen for 2010 Formula One season with Nico Rosberg keen on Brawn[/size]

[size=11pt]Who’s In and Who’s Out[/size]

Brawn GP

Jenson Button wants to stay with hopes high that his contract dispute will be sorted out within days. Rubens Barrichello is going to Williams, making Nico Rosberg favourite to move to the world champions.

Possible for 2010 — Jenson Button, Nico Rosberg Out — Rubens Barrichello


Red Bull


Stability for Formula One’s second team. Sebastian Vettel is a future champion and has been locked in, while Mark Webber, with two victories, is also in for 2010.

Certain for 2010 — Sebastian Vettel, Mark Webber

McLaren Mercedes

With Heikki Kovalainen failing dismally, McLaren have courted Rosberg, but now could make a surprise move for Kimi Raikkonen to return to the team.

Possible — Lewis Hamilton, Kimi Raikkonen or Nico Rosberg Out — Heikki Kovalainen

Ferrari

Their long pursuit of Fernando Alonso now complete, Ferrari can field a formidable pairing for 2010. Felipe Massa is likely to return even more determined to put right the wrong of his 2008 championship.

Certain — Felipe Massa, Fernando Alonso Out — Kimi Raikkonen

Toyota

In a state of flux with negotiations taking place to hire Raikkonen. Will Jarno Trulli stay? Or Timo Glock? And did Kamui Kobayashi do enough in Brazil to get his chance? We think so.

Possible — Kimi Raikkonen, Kamui Kobayashi Out — Jarno Trulli, Timo Glock

Williams

Vastly improved effort this season deserves an experienced hand like Barrichello. He will be partnered by Nico Hulkenberg, a rising star much praised by Sir Frank Williams and Patrick Head.

Probable — Rubens Barrichello, Nico Hulkenberg Out — Nico Rosberg, Kazuki Nakajima

BMW Sauber

So farewell, then, BMW Sauber, unless the other teams change their minds and allow 14 teams on to the grid next season, or one of the three new squads drops out. So no driver search yet, leaving Nick Heidfeld looking for work.

Out — Nick Heidfeld, Robert Kubica

Renault

Losing Alonso is a blow, gaining Robert Kubica, the Polish charger, is a bonus. Only question is whether Roman Grosjean has done enough to stay on.

Possible — Robert Kubica, Roman Grosjean Out — Fernando Alonso

Force India
Surprised everyone with late-season pace. Adrian Sutil is quick but messy and the team may decide they need an experienced driver to replace Giancarlo Fisichella, who is going to Ferrari as chief test driver.

Possible — Adrian Sutil, Vitantonio Liuzzi Out — Giancarlo Fisichella

Toro Rosso

Formula One’s crèche bloods new talent. Sébastien Buemi has had his moments while Jaime Alguersuari has struggled. But they might warrant a second season together.

Possible — Sébastien Buemi, Jaime Alguersuari

Manor Grand Prix

New kids on the block for 2010 are starting from scratch and, ideally, need an old hand to help develop their car. That could open up a return for Anthony Davidson, the former BAR Honda tester, alongside a young gun.

Possible — Anthony Davidson

Campos

Could be the best opportunity for Nelson Piquet Jr to return to the grid after “Crashgateâ€. His father has money to spend and the Spanish team could be built around him.

Possible — Nelson Piquet Jr

Lotus Formula One

The third of the new teams, this one being run by Mike Gascoyne, formerly technical director at Toyota. Which could open a place for Trulli, if ditched by Toyota. The line-up will be announced at the end of the month.

Possible — Jarno Trulli
 
Another big one bites the dust......

[size=12pt]Toyota pulls out of Formula One [/size]

Toyota has pulled out of Formula One motor racing in a move that deals yet another blow to the scandal-hit sport and leaves it entirely without participation by Japanese automakers, tyremakers or big corporate sponsors.

The decision highlights a rising sense of panic both in the world’s second biggest economy and on the board of the world’s biggest car manufacturer, which told a hastily-convened press conference that its decision “reflected the current severe economic realitiesâ€.

Sources close to the company believe the decision may also arise from embarrassment at having scored such limited success despite having the backing of the iconic Japanese automotive company. The Toyota Formula One team, which is based in Cologne in Germany, has never achieved a race win in eight seasons in the sport but was regarded as one of the biggest spenders in the paddock.

Since its Formula One debut in 2002, the team has managed only three pole positions and three fastest laps, giving it one of the worst returns on its investment in the paddock, which is thought to amount to a total of nearly two billion pounds. This season it again under-performed with its team finishing fifth in the constructors' championship and its leading driver, Jarno Trulli, finishing eighth in the drivers' standings.

Bowing to the cameras in Tokyo, Akio Toyoda, the president of Toyota and scion of the founding Toyoda family, apologised for the miserable performance of the team. "This was a difficult but inevitable decision," said Mr Toyoda. “Since last year with the worsening economic climate, we have been wrestling with the question of whether to press on in Formula One. Now we are exiting Formula One completely. I apologise to Toyota's many fans for not being able to achieve the results we had intended to achieve."

Toyota said that it was intending to “do its best to find a solution†and is already rumoured to be scouting around for an Asian or Middle Eastern buyer for the team. Toyota also apologised publicly to its sponsors: it is understood that the company did not warn them in advance that it was about to quit. A spokesman for Panasonic, the largest sponsor of Toyota’s F1 team, said that it “respected†Toyota’s decision.

Toyota’s pullout follows a similar move by Bridgestone, the Tokyo-based company that announced three days ago that it would stop providing tyres to all the Formula One teams after the 2010 season. Bridgestone’s decision, combined with Honda’s abrupt and emotional exit from the sport last year, completes the exodus from Formula One by Japanese companies: cost is understood to be the prime concern behind all three decisions, though industry insiders said that the sport’s image is increasingly out of synch with the Japanese firms’ corporate emphasis on “green†technologies.

Toyota had previously asserted that it would continue to field a team until 2012 but the ongoing misery in its mainstream car business has made the Formula One team too heavy a cost burden. Toyota is due to report financial results for the half year tomorrow, with the outlook for global car markets still uncertain. Nissan, which reported results today, upgraded its forecasts for the full year and told investors to expect a profit of Y120 billion rather than the previously forecast loss of Y100 billion. Toyota, which has not penetrated the Chinese market as effectively as Nissan, may not be able to match that upgrade and is expected to predict heavy losses for the full year.

Toyota’s move away from Formula One comes despite Honda’s visible regret at its own decision to quit the sport. When Honda sold its team last year, its new owners, led by Ross Brawn, delivered constructors’ championship victory for the former Honda car and the drivers' championship for Jenson Button. Analysts have estimated that Honda may have missed out on $255 million worth of brand exposure via its absence from Formula One.

Toyota’s dwindling interest in the sport was apparent last month when the company withdrew its sponsorship of the Japanese Grand Prix, which was held on the Fuji Speedway circuit that the company itself owns.
 
Rubens signs on at Williams. Good move for both parties, especially if this kid they're looking to sign is any use. Rubens can school him on a few things.

Rubens Barrichello just goes on and on. Already the record-holder for the most Formula One grands prix started by a driver, with 285, he will become next year the sport’s longest-serving driver in terms of consecutive seasons when he begins his eighteenth year, this time with Williams.

The team run by Sir Frank Williams and Patrick Head, who are based in Grove, Oxfordshire, and have been in the doldrums for at least five years, confirmed yesterday that they had signed the 37-year-old. The Brazilian won two races for Brawn GP this season on his way to third place in the World Championship.

Barrichello, who surprised some with his electric qualifying pace in the second half of the season and the challenge he mounted to Jenson Button, his team-mate and the eventual champion, will drive alongside Nico Hulkenberg, the highly rated young German. The winner of the GP2 series this year, Hulkenberg is considered a potential future champion who will be able to learn from Barrichello.
 
Mercedes confirm takeover of Brawn GP

Mercedes-Benz has bought the Brawn GP Formula One team in a move that could see Jenson Button join Lewis Hamilton at McLaren next season.

The German manufacturer now owns a 75.1 per cent stake in Brawn, which will be rebranded as the Mercedes GP team from next season. Ross Brawn will remain in his role as team principal but will work alongside Norbert Haug, the director of motor sport at Mercedes-Benz. The future of Brawn's drivers is less certain.

German-born Nico Rosberg has been signed from Williams for next season and it is widely believed that Mercedes want him as the figurehead of a German-led operation at Brawn. Despite having won the world championship last month, Button has been unable to negotiate a substantial pay rise from Brawn, leaving him to choose between accepting the deal on the table or moving to McLaren.

Even though that would form a “dream team†of successive English world champions, Button has been hurt by the failure of Brawn to come up with a deal he believes would confirm his new status. The Somerset-born driver, 29, took a £5million pay cut to £3m last season, but expected recognition of his loyalty after winning the championship. He has been offered a £4m a year pay deal by Brawn.

As part of the deal to buy Brawn, Daimler AG, Mercedes' parent company, has relinquished its 40 per cent stake in McLaren, but will remain their engine suppliers for the next six seasons.

"Mercedes-Benz will enter the Formula One World Championship with its own team, beginning with the 2010 season, and Daimler AG and McLaren Group will change their form of cooperation with effect as of 13 November 2009," a statement released on Brawn GP's website read: "Daimler AG together with Aabar Investments PJSC will take over 75.1 per cent of the Brawn GP team, with Daimler taking 45.1 per cent and Aabar 30 per cent. The rest of the 24.9 per cent will remain with the current stakeholders."

From being down and out when Honda, the Japanese carmaker, quit Formula One a year ago, the team has been revived under Ross Brawn, who delivered the constructors' world championship last season. Brawn admitted he was delighted with the deal and hoped the team could go build on last season's success.

"We are honoured to be representing such a prestigious brand as Mercedes-Benz in Formula One next year and will be working together to do our best to reward their faith in our team," Brawn said. "Brawn GP has been through an incredible journey over the last 12 months. From fighting for our survival to forging a strong relationship with Mercedes-Benz High Performance Engines, winning both the constructors and drivers world championships, and now accepting Daimler and Aabars offer to buy our team, which will secure its future."

Daimler AG, Mercedes' parent company, posted net losses of $1.51 billion during the second quarter of the year and board member Helmut Lense said earlier this year that Mercedes should end its expensive involvement in the sport.
 
Jenson Button runs rule over McLaren

The possibility of Jenson Button joining McLaren Mercedes next season grew stronger on Friday after the Formula One world champion was given a guided tour around the team’s headquarters in Woking.

If Button turns his back on Brawn GP, for whom he won this year’s world title, to sign for McLaren he will team up with Lewis Hamilton to form British motor racing’s dream ticket. McLaren would be the first team with two world champions competing alongside each other since they paired Ayrton Senna and Alain Prost in 1989.

Button and Richard Goddard, his manager, were escorted around the Surrey plant by Martin Whitmarsh, the McLaren team principal.

“As I’ve said many times before, Jenson wants to drive a car which is capable of winning the next world championship,†Goddard said. “We’ve been talking about possible terms for 2010 with Brawn for months and we are not being difficult or unreasonably expensive in our demands. In fact, we’ve given up quite a lot of negotiating ground in our discussions.â€

Related Links
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Barrichello to set another record with deal
Button enjoys his honeymoon period
A McLaren spokesman said: “Having just arrived at Heathrow, Jenson made a small detour to Woking to say hello.â€

The world champion has been seeking a new contract at Brawn worth at least £8 million a year after taking a £5 million pay cut this year to help the team to stay in business.

It is understood that Button has moved to the top of McLaren’s wanted list for next season over the past couple of months, with Whitmarsh and his fellow directors impressed by the Briton’s tenacity in regaining his form to round off the season with outstanding drives in the Brazilian and Abu Dhabi grands prix.

McLaren have made Kimi Raikkonen their second choice if the approach to Button fails, with Nick Heidfeld third favourite. McLaren also played host to Raikkonen on Wednesday, when the 2007 world champion visited their base with his managers, David and Steve Robertson.

Niki Lauda, who won the last of his three world championships with McLaren in 1984, had a word of warning for Button if the 29-year-old decides to change teams.

“One of the problems faced by drivers today is that there is generally less money around in the business than there was,†Lauda said. “So if I was Jenson, I would try to stay with Brawn even if Ross might pay him slightly less than McLaren. Of course, if McLaren are going to pay a lot more, then he must go.

“But the other thing he must consider is that it is Lewis’s team and he needs to be sure he has the confidence to deal with this. It is a tough decision for Jenson and he needs to think it through carefully.â€

If Button did join McLaren, he would want to do so on equal footing with Hamilton. McLaren, though, are known for giving their drivers parity of equipment and allowing them to race unfettered for grand prix wins and the world championship.
 
Raikkonen rejects F1 for rallying

Former world champion Kimi Raikkonen will not be racing in Formula 1 next year after failing to find a drive.

The 30-year-old Finn had been trying to do a deal with McLaren but they would not offer him the salary he wanted, his manager David Robertson told BBC Sport.

"They couldn't afford him," Roberston said. "It wasn't in his interests to race for what they were offering so he's going to go rallying instead."

Robertson said he believed McLaren had already signed Jenson Button.

Raikkonen, who won the world title for Ferrari in 2007, was forced out of Ferrari at the end of this season to make way for Fernando Alonso, despite already having a year left on his contract.

Raikkonen is being paid a sum believed to be in the region of 20m Euro not to race for Ferrari in 2010, but still wanted to be paid what he felt was a fair sum to drive for another team.

Robertson would not confirm the Ferrari payment, describing his arrangements with Ferrari as "confidential".

Although he won the Belgian Grand Prix, Raikkonen's final season with Ferrari was a disappointment, with car that was never the fastest in the field.

He said: "Kimi wanted a winning car, only McLaren could supply that and he only had them in his sights. He didn't want another year like this one.

"But they had their issues with Mercedes, Santander and the FIA and from a financial point of view they are not the powerhouse they were. They couldn't afford him."

Mercedes announced on Tuesday that they were selling back their 40% shareholding in McLaren and buying the Brawn team instead.

Spanish bank Santander will sponsor Ferrari next year, although they will still retain a smaller presence with McLaren.

And governing body the FIA in 2007 fined McLaren $100m (then £49m) after they were found guilty of possessing confidential Ferrari technical information.

What a fucking prat.
So much talent, it's shame he is going off to do rallying.
 
Jenson Button to partner Lewis Hamilton in McLaren 'dream team'

Jenson Button is expected to be confirmed later today as Lewis Hamilton's team-mate at McLaren, after he failed to agree terms with Brawn GP, now renamed Mercedes Grand Prix.

A McLaren spokesman would not confirm reports this morning that Button has signed a deal worth £6 million a year but he did nothing to head off mounting speculation that the new world champion has agreed terms with the Woking-based outfit.

Button will thus take a seat on the other side of the McLaren garage from Hamilton in what some commentators have termed an all-English "dream team." Others wonder, however, whether it might turn into an all-English nightmare for Button as he tries to match Hamilton, his predecessor as world champion.

The move to McLaren for Button is thought to be principally about money. Button's camp claimed he had been offered only £4 million to stay with Ross Brawn's team but sources there now say they have offered him £8 million, two more than he is reportedly getting at McLaren.

While the move is clearly a big risk for Button, it also leaves Mercedes Grand Prix with a distinct lack of quality in their driver line-up. They are believed to have signed the German driver Nico Rosberg and may now plump for the former BMW Sauber driver Nick Heidfeld. Neither of those two have won a Grand Prix and the team may yet regret allowing Rubens Barrichello to leave to join Williams.

Overnight it also emerged that the former Ferrari driver, Kimi Raikkonen, who had been linked to the McLaren seat ahead of Button, is to take a year off in 2010 but is hoping to return to Formula One in 2011. There is already speculation that he has a drive confirmed, amid suggestions that he might join the Red Bull team in place of Mark Webber.

"The alternatives at F1 level for next season were McLaren or nothing," Steve Robertson, Raikkonen's manager, said. "Kimi and McLaren did not reach an agreement, so he will not drive at F1 level at least during next year."

Raikkonen, who spent five years at McLaren before joining Ferrari at the end of 2006, announced that he would quit the Italian team before the end of last season even though he had a year to run on his contract. He has been replaced by Fernando Alonso.
 
Button + Hamilton.

Alonso + Massa.

Will be interesting to see who Brawn sign up too.

Next season should be fun to watch.
 
Dunno, but the only potential spanner in the works for those two being at Brawn is Raikonnen, who seems to be in limbo
 
Kimi Raikkonen, most likely.

Oh, and is Piquet going to pump stupid amounts of cash into a team so Piquet jr can race again?
 
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