i’d give you ten likes for this if i could. he needs to bin egypt, sorry egypt he has done enough and it’s hampering the tail end of his career
they’re going to win fuck all anyway
Salah’s future
- Thread starter rurikbird
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i’d give you ten likes for this if i could. he needs to bin egypt, sorry egypt he has done enough and it’s hampering the tail end of his career
they’re going to win fuck all anyway
He's been declining steadily, but even so, you will have to define which afcon. You could have made the same claim several times about Salah, like 21/22 when he was shit post afcon, without the injury. Or when he was in poor form for a chunk of last season. You can't decide that salahs best form is his real form, when he has had this variance for a while, while the average declines.
And declining steadily since 21/22 is your opinion.
I would not dispute the fact that he’s “declining steadily,” but an all-time great naturally has a lot of room for that steady decline, because the peak was so high. And great players always find ways to compensate for attributes they are losing by being more efficient. There will always be a point when it’s not worth it for a team to keep them, but has this point arrived with Salah? I’m not sure.
For a sense of perspective, think about this: most of the attackers we’re been linked with by the press will never in their career come close to what Salah has achieved. Pretty much none of the 70M+ wingers on the market have ever posted a 20+ goal and 15+ assist season and likely never will. Salah will have to decline for a long time on his downward slope and they would have to climb up for a long time for them to meet in the middle.
For a sense of perspective, think about this: most of the attackers we’re been linked with by the press will never in their career come close to what Salah has achieved. Pretty much none of the 70M+ wingers on the market have ever posted a 20+ goal and 15+ assist season and likely never will. Salah will have to decline for a long time on his downward slope and they would have to climb up for a long time for them to meet in the middle.
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you’re looking at the individual though, not the group or the function of the attack / right side of the team
does a younger, faster but less polished player track back tirelessly or absolutely torment the fullback and need two men on him constantly
then there’s money to add to the worthwhile keeping equation
it feels like where united were with ronaldo
does a younger, faster but less polished player track back tirelessly or absolutely torment the fullback and need two men on him constantly
then there’s money to add to the worthwhile keeping equation
it feels like where united were with ronaldo
I'm sorry but this is just leaning on his historical highs. Frankly I've no interest in them at this moment. What I want to know is can he continue to be a relevant part of the team, and not just the attack, next season.
And will he leave on a free when we could find his replacement now (which would likely be a better replacement than if he leaves on a free).
Let's be clear, 12 non penalty PL goals is Nunez level. Not elite PL leading goal scorer level.
And the Salah apologists keep avoiding the other pertinent questions :
How about his lost pace?
What of his shooting that has lost power and accuracy
Where has his trickery and dribbling gone?
Where is his pressing and how will the lack of it affect the team?
What of his defensive actions that seem to be non existant?
He'll be 32 to start next season and finish it at almost 33? Are you sure they're isn't going to be a cliff drop in performance?
How much is he worth now compared to the end of the season (zilch)?
Honestly, I think some people in here are on a massive wind up.
You can get a huge chunk of saudi cash for a 32 yo declining footballer, who is also on a massive wedge.
It is like winning the lottery while getting sucked off by Scarlet, and your arse fingered by "fill in name of choice.
You can get a huge chunk of saudi cash for a 32 yo declining footballer, who is also on a massive wedge.
It is like winning the lottery while getting sucked off by Scarlet, and your arse fingered by "fill in name of choice.
lebron james
Oh, I agree that he has declined. That is a certainty given age and games per season.
Its also natural to lose some of his pace.
I just dont think the decline is of the scale being talked about on here given that he has evolved his game at the same time.
Going from a goalscorer to a goalscorer and a creator.
So in terms of output you still get top of class. It seems people cant see the creator side for some reason.
But he’s been so uncharacteristically bad these months after AFCON and his injury that I think people are getting a bit carried away.
The drop off isnt that big and there is still gas in the tank if Edwards decides that this is the way forward.
Salah must be the only legend at the club that divide the fan base at this level. I dont really get it, but each to their own.
I’m fine with either selling or keeping. Its up to Edwards and Hughes to build the best possible squad and I think they’ll nail it.
Scarlet can do both if she wishes.
I was saying this 14 months ago.
that made my back door shrivel up
consider a list of attributes you want a right sided forward to have in a liverpool team, which does he have in abundance now?
maybe he is a fantastic creator but where do we put him? KDB is about to encounter a similar issue when his physicality reduces past the point that city are happy with even though he’s still fantastically creative
Main difference is with de bruyne I can see him dropping deeper and deeper though, as his vision and range of passing is that good.
yea he might have the stevie g path of a few years quarter backing yet
What’s stopping us finding his replacement now anyway? Why can’t we buy a successor and give him a chance to bed in and while also taking the pressure and load off?
Regarding the non PL goals and Salah apologists, I think some of us are not that bothered either way because of what he has given us since but jump in to defend him because of the accusations are borderline disrespectful and BS. Some of the criticism is rather unfair at best.
The penalty exclusion? Penalties are so weighted with pressure and unique, why would you not value that? Takes some balls to take a penalty in CL final or against united away. Would you really give it to Nunez whom missed the only penalty he had when 2-0 up and cruising. Can only think Macca as the other viable alternative.
I think Klopp wasn't able to figure out a system for a slowing Salah but maybe the right plan can get the best out of him. I just worry that Trent + Salah means there's always a hole. I hope a top level DM is our big priority along with a striker
Salah is not a CF and he missed almost half a season with injury. How many wingers in a top league in Europe have scored more than 12 non-penalty goals + 9 assists in a season, let alone half a season? Even Saka scored fewer non-penalty goals than Mo.
For comparison:
Johan Bakayoko: 11 goals and 9 assists - very similar, but it’s Eredivisie
Rafael Leao (who I think is boss): 7 goals, 9 assists
Saka: 10 non-penalty goals, 9 assists
Not even comparing him to the likes of Grealish, Doku or, say, Mitoma who are all in lower single digits despite being highly rated and expensive. Just to show how difficult it is to replace Salah’s production, even if you have money to spend.
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Trent inverting for me is a failed experiment, especially with Salah, but regardless really.
Benzema
Suarez
Zlatan
Giggs
Henry
Aguero
Lewandowski
There’s literally a fuck tonne of top forwards that have contributed at top clubs well into their mid 30’s
How is it failed? Our results have been better since we started doing it.
You should get used to it - Slot deploys inverted full backs too - in fact likes both full backs to invert, all be it not at the same time - he sets up asymmetrically, so whichever’s be inverts, the other doesn’t - but both FBs do it.
It’ll be more about control though - Klopp’s version isn’t.
I am still very intrigued by the idea of Trent at RCM in Slot’s system (BTW most Youtube analists say his basic system is 4-2-3-1, but that’s based on the title-winning season; in the current season he’s been almost exclusively playing 4-3-3). I don’t think it would have worked for Klopp who needs his RCM to be a tireless runner like Szoboszlai or Hendo - Trent is never that player. But in a different system that’s a real possibility, I think.
If so, Bradley, Gomez or that Gertrude lad (sp.) if we buy him will be the one who inverts from full-back. Trent on the other hand will be someone who starts in the middle and ends up on wide right ready to put the cross in as the attack develops.
Yeah - I’ve watched a few 4231 Slit setups, but like you said he seems to have evolved it to a 433 now.
I agree though, it’s not certain Trent will continue at RB - he could move to RM in a 433 or he could be part of the double pivot in a 4231.
Few options there - be interesting to see what way Slot goes.
There are a handful, but none in England, and we could pick at what is different about these, some are units who never needed pace, and would have continued gaining strength. Several are just far more technically gifted.
And then there's Giggs. What the fuck is Giggs doing on that list?
And then there's Giggs. What the fuck is Giggs doing on that list?
The usual keep/sellarguments aside, can you really expect that?
I haven't seen any intent whatsoever from the Saudi league on keeping the spend going this year and there has been no indication from Salah or his loudmouth agent of wanting to go there (even last summer)
If you’re talking about my list of old attacking players that contributed well in to their 30’s - then Giggs is on it because he’s an attacking player that continued to contribute till well in to his 30’s.
And if we’re going down the road of limiting it to England.
Drogba had his best season in terms of goals at Chelsea aged 31/32 and continued for another 2 seasons.
Aguero was at City til he was 32.
Zola didn’t sign for Chelsea until he was 30 and played for 7 years with his best goal return in his last year aged way over 32.
Jermaine Defoe hit 15 goals twice in a League season for Sunderland aged 33+
Jamie Vardy had 3 seasons of 15+ goals in him from the age of 33.
Even Peter Crouch’s scoring remained consistent until he was 35.
So it’s pure nonsense to suggest that there are no players over the age of 32 that can deliver the goods.
It’s down to whether the player can maintain focus, fitness and is playing in a system that utilises him best.
Aguero was phased out in his last two seasons. If we could afford to have played Salah 30 times this season, and a dozen the next, I'd be fine with it.
Zola didn't play for an elite team, and averaged about 30 starts a season. If our team had similar ambitions and quality, sure we should keep Salah.
Drogba was one of the most physical footballers of all time. At 32 he had more strength than at 26. This one I'll definitely give you, but if Salah was great playing with his back to the goal and great at hold up play, I'd be fine keeping him for a couple more years as well. These are things he isn't good at, at all, despite being strong, because he's spent his entire career using his pace.
Vardy is the best analog, in terms of speed, as the first candidate that actually is a speed player. I'm not sure I'd say that he played for an elite club when he was old, but he won the golden boot, so I'll allow it. His overall contribution to the team toward the end was absolutely nothing other than finishing, on a team that played a counterattacking style. Salah could definitely contribute 15 goals, it's just a question of the cost. He definitely couldn't play Vardy's role though, because he isn't finding the pace to break away anymore and has lost more speed than Vardy. A model for what we should be looking to do though?
Then we are scraping the bottom of the barrel. Peter Crouch? Jermaine Defoe?
Look guys, this brings me no joy. I'm going to physical therapy for my fucking knee. You think I want being old to make you shittier? Sorry, it does. And these handful of questionable examples as a justification? Start thinking of the opposite - players who just got shittier. It's not hard to do. It's not hard to see that he's been shittier either.
Salah could be his own outlier sure, he's certainly got the drive and the professionalism. Perhaps he could be reinvigorated under the right circumstances and a new system of play. A nice indian summer. If he gets some better play around him, the rising tide will lift all boats. He can play a lethal pass, and maybe he can add more to his game. If we can control more games he won't have to defend as much. I don't think it's crazy to think that, it's just an expensive idea.
As I said before this season and before the last, I just don't see Salah being the difference maker, the reason that we succeed or fail. Maybe we can afford to just let him fizzle out with us and have a nice old send off. I don't see him being willing to accept a diminished role, coming on to the cheers and plaudits from time to time, as say an Aguero did his last season.
He could also just be a little worse next year overall after a nice start. That's my guess, and I don't see why its controversial in the least bit, given what he has looked like.
You’re trying to add in criteria to suit your argument.
Why does it have to be an “elite club” now - do you want to add in a specific star sign or eye colour to narrow the field further?
Zola is a great example - he was a quality player and you’re just plucking things out that doesn’t stack up - Zola played more AFTER he hit 32 - in fact in his last 5 seasons up the age of 37 he missed only 11 league games in total - he played in all 38 games.
Aguero was massively hampered by injuries - Salah isn’t.
Scrapping the bottom of the barrel???? Really - they were just examples that came to mind - I can go find others if you need to to ram the point further home - and incidentally if Defoe hitting 15 league goals in 2 seasons aged 32+ is scraping the barrel - where does that put Nunez who barely gets to double figures in the league.
The point I made at the bottom stands - yes you can find players that got worse and yes you can find players that didn’t.
Salah’s stats haven’t dropped off a cliff - so there’s no reason to think they will and it’s more likely that he’s got more than a few good seasons left in him - his role will diminish over time, for sure, but it doesn’t NEED to just yet.
It absolutely isn’t JUST about him - we need to have another forward we can trust to provide 15+ league goals.
We don’t have that - fix that, then fix the Salah problem is what I’m saying.
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