Downing
- Thread starter El Pistolero
- Start date
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It is fucking silly. The owners will have very little detailed input on purchasing, precisely because they don't know anything about it, like the owners of all the top clubs in our league. It's one thing if they did get directly involved, like Abramovich, with vanity purchases, but they simply don't.
So who cares that he was a little gullible about a game he has little experience with in some insignificant and private conversation that is being paraphrased.
Criticise their appointment of Commoli, or rather, criticise how they deal with the abject failures of their initial scouting/purchasing strategy and team, once we see how they do deal with it.
*Hrm, didn't see your edit.
So who cares that he was a little gullible about a game he has little experience with in some insignificant and private conversation that is being paraphrased.
Criticise their appointment of Commoli, or rather, criticise how they deal with the abject failures of their initial scouting/purchasing strategy and team, once we see how they do deal with it.
*Hrm, didn't see your edit.
Re: Re: Downing
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327360946]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469427#msg1469427 date=1327359958]
Do you think Lucas would be struggling if Charlie Adam fucked his knee?
[/quote]
Like when he played alongside Masher and more was asked of him offensively? It's a dumb point.
[/quote]
I get ryans argument.
Adam is noticibly struggling without lucas, would lucas struggle without adam? No, I doubt it
But then there's the flip side, adam is suffering due to increasing defending, restraining his attacking. would lucas be as bad if there was increased attacking impetus required from him, restraining his defending?
Again, I'd say no, as lucas is decent at attacking too.
But hey, I like lucas but am not sold on adam fully yet so I'm bias
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327360946]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469427#msg1469427 date=1327359958]
Do you think Lucas would be struggling if Charlie Adam fucked his knee?
[/quote]
Like when he played alongside Masher and more was asked of him offensively? It's a dumb point.
[/quote]
I get ryans argument.
Adam is noticibly struggling without lucas, would lucas struggle without adam? No, I doubt it
But then there's the flip side, adam is suffering due to increasing defending, restraining his attacking. would lucas be as bad if there was increased attacking impetus required from him, restraining his defending?
Again, I'd say no, as lucas is decent at attacking too.
But hey, I like lucas but am not sold on adam fully yet so I'm bias
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. It was a good deal and he has shown he can put in fine performances for us (Chelsea sticks out). I'm not his biggest fan and he's in a slump but let's not go OTT. He needs to get back doing the simple things and stop being a jerk. Of course he would benefit from having a more defensive minded player behind him. Lucas also benefits from having an attack minded player in front of him. It works both ways. Gutted Lucas got injured, they were starting to blossom together.
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. It was a good deal and he has shown he can put in fine performances for us (Chelsea sticks out). I'm not his biggest fan and he's in a slump but let's not go OTT. He needs to get back doing the simple things and stop being a jerk. Of course he would benefit from having a more defensive minded player behind him. Lucas also benefits from having an attack minded player in front of him. It works both ways. Gutted Lucas got injured, they were starting to blossom together.
Lucas will never struggle...he is superman.
* I don't believe a word of what i said above. I'm merely reflecting the opinion on this forum.
Anyway, he will have to earn his place back when he returns. Some speak as if he was the God King of football, and reincarnation of Cruyff and Platini rolled in one footballer. He performed better than average in a squad the has finished mostly in 6th or 7th place while he was a regular starter. Fuck me...
* I don't believe a word of what i said above. I'm merely reflecting the opinion on this forum.
Anyway, he will have to earn his place back when he returns. Some speak as if he was the God King of football, and reincarnation of Cruyff and Platini rolled in one footballer. He performed better than average in a squad the has finished mostly in 6th or 7th place while he was a regular starter. Fuck me...
[quote author=ILD link=topic=44931.msg1469472#msg1469472 date=1327375626]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. [/quote]
Scott Parker
Johann Cabaye
Both similar prices, both better players.
All that typed, I'm doing Chaz a bit of a disservice over the last couple of days on here. He's not that bad, and he's not been that bad. In fact he's a fairly decent midfielder who's had some good games for us, so there's not much to hate. He's good enough for a side fighting it out for 6th which is what we are.
He's not great though, and he never will be. It might just be a personal thing, but I really fucking detest players who feel the need to ping a 30 yard ball when there's an equally good option on 5 metres away. It adds nothing, and I fucking loathe looking at it. It's got to the stage now where I see him drawing his leg back and all I can do is reach for the bucket or the keyboard. Play it simple, retain the ball, move and receive. It's fundamental, but the best sides going around right now do it beest because they do it easiest. I long more than anything for a side and for players that are fluid in possession, comfortable on the ball, interchange with ease and can adapt to opposition, scorelines, and tactics with ease. I don't want a fucking Arsenal playing the ball around like they're going through 90 minutes of foreplay without ever wanting to fuck the thing, I just want good football and good footballers who9 can play, can win and allow me to fucking enjoy watching them.
For me, Adam (and it's shit to single him out I know when there are plenty of others alongside and even ahead of him in this queue) doesn't represent that, and never will. He's just annoying me.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. [/quote]
Scott Parker
Johann Cabaye
Both similar prices, both better players.
All that typed, I'm doing Chaz a bit of a disservice over the last couple of days on here. He's not that bad, and he's not been that bad. In fact he's a fairly decent midfielder who's had some good games for us, so there's not much to hate. He's good enough for a side fighting it out for 6th which is what we are.
He's not great though, and he never will be. It might just be a personal thing, but I really fucking detest players who feel the need to ping a 30 yard ball when there's an equally good option on 5 metres away. It adds nothing, and I fucking loathe looking at it. It's got to the stage now where I see him drawing his leg back and all I can do is reach for the bucket or the keyboard. Play it simple, retain the ball, move and receive. It's fundamental, but the best sides going around right now do it beest because they do it easiest. I long more than anything for a side and for players that are fluid in possession, comfortable on the ball, interchange with ease and can adapt to opposition, scorelines, and tactics with ease. I don't want a fucking Arsenal playing the ball around like they're going through 90 minutes of foreplay without ever wanting to fuck the thing, I just want good football and good footballers who9 can play, can win and allow me to fucking enjoy watching them.
For me, Adam (and it's shit to single him out I know when there are plenty of others alongside and even ahead of him in this queue) doesn't represent that, and never will. He's just annoying me.
Now that post is waaaaaaaaaay better Ryan than your initial OTT musings.
Yeah I would have liked Scott Parker but he's 31 (Im guessing) and Lucas carries out a similar role to Scott. I think Parker is excellent at what he does and was a perfect short term signing for Spurs. He allows Modric to express himself and is very neat and tidy. I also rate Cabaye but that's beside the point, the Adam deal was decent and he'll flourish again with a more defensive minded player along side of him. If you go back and read any post I've made about Adam you would see I am in total agreement with you. I had a habit of calling him a self indulgent bastard but he put in some fine displays for us culminating in some goals and assists. I like his heart and desire, when others hid he did try drive us forward. He'll be okay we just need to get back to a system that get's the best out of players. We might need to buy some players first mind.
Yeah I would have liked Scott Parker but he's 31 (Im guessing) and Lucas carries out a similar role to Scott. I think Parker is excellent at what he does and was a perfect short term signing for Spurs. He allows Modric to express himself and is very neat and tidy. I also rate Cabaye but that's beside the point, the Adam deal was decent and he'll flourish again with a more defensive minded player along side of him. If you go back and read any post I've made about Adam you would see I am in total agreement with you. I had a habit of calling him a self indulgent bastard but he put in some fine displays for us culminating in some goals and assists. I like his heart and desire, when others hid he did try drive us forward. He'll be okay we just need to get back to a system that get's the best out of players. We might need to buy some players first mind.
Re: Re: Downing
[quote author=Fascistio link=topic=44931.msg1469461#msg1469461 date=1327366079]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327360946]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469427#msg1469427 date=1327359958]
Do you think Lucas would be struggling if Charlie Adam fucked his knee?
[/quote]
Like when he played alongside Masher and more was asked of him offensively? It's a dumb point.
[/quote]
I get ryans argument.
Adam is noticibly struggling without lucas, would lucas struggle without adam? No, I doubt it
But then there's the flip side, adam is suffering due to increasing defending, restraining his attacking. would lucas be as bad if there was increased attacking impetus required from him, restraining his defending?
Again, I'd say no, as lucas is decent at attacking too.
But hey, I like lucas but am not sold on adam fully yet so I'm bias
[/quote]
Lucas is not decent at attacking, as evidenced by his total lack of goals and assists. Any time the onus has been on him to create (which was most of Rafa's last season when he assumed that Lucas could fill the void left by Alonso), he's been found wanting. I'm not having a go at him like, he's improved massively, and does the job of defensive midfielder much better than I ever thought he would. But he's virtually redundant as an attacking threat.
And I agree with doc mac in that their strengths (and to a large extent their weaknesses) mean that they are complimentary players. I''d play Shelvey ahead of Adam at the moment, though. But then I think Shelvey is a phenomenon waiting to happen, so I would say that.
[quote author=Fascistio link=topic=44931.msg1469461#msg1469461 date=1327366079]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327360946]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469427#msg1469427 date=1327359958]
Do you think Lucas would be struggling if Charlie Adam fucked his knee?
[/quote]
Like when he played alongside Masher and more was asked of him offensively? It's a dumb point.
[/quote]
I get ryans argument.
Adam is noticibly struggling without lucas, would lucas struggle without adam? No, I doubt it
But then there's the flip side, adam is suffering due to increasing defending, restraining his attacking. would lucas be as bad if there was increased attacking impetus required from him, restraining his defending?
Again, I'd say no, as lucas is decent at attacking too.
But hey, I like lucas but am not sold on adam fully yet so I'm bias
[/quote]
Lucas is not decent at attacking, as evidenced by his total lack of goals and assists. Any time the onus has been on him to create (which was most of Rafa's last season when he assumed that Lucas could fill the void left by Alonso), he's been found wanting. I'm not having a go at him like, he's improved massively, and does the job of defensive midfielder much better than I ever thought he would. But he's virtually redundant as an attacking threat.
And I agree with doc mac in that their strengths (and to a large extent their weaknesses) mean that they are complimentary players. I''d play Shelvey ahead of Adam at the moment, though. But then I think Shelvey is a phenomenon waiting to happen, so I would say that.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469477#msg1469477 date=1327378899]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=44931.msg1469472#msg1469472 date=1327375626]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. [/quote]
Scott Parker
Johann Cabaye
Both similar prices, both better players.
All that typed, I'm doing Chaz a bit of a disservice over the last couple of days on here. He's not that bad, and he's not been that bad. In fact he's a fairly decent midfielder who's had some good games for us, so there's not much to hate. He's good enough for a side fighting it out for 6th which is what we are.
He's not great though, and he never will be. It might just be a personal thing, but I really fucking detest players who feel the need to ping a 30 yard ball when there's an equally good option on 5 metres away. It adds nothing, and I fucking loathe looking at it. It's got to the stage now where I see him drawing his leg back and all I can do is reach for the bucket or the keyboard. Play it simple, retain the ball, move and receive. It's fundamental, but the best sides going around right now do it beest because they do it easiest. I long more than anything for a side and for players that are fluid in possession, comfortable on the ball, interchange with ease and can adapt to opposition, scorelines, and tactics with ease. I don't want a fucking Arsenal playing the ball around like they're going through 90 minutes of foreplay without ever wanting to fuck the thing, I just want good football and good footballers who9 can play, can win and allow me to fucking enjoy watching them.
For me, Adam (and it's shit to single him out I know when there are plenty of others alongside and even ahead of him in this queue) doesn't represent that, and never will. He's just annoying me.
[/quote]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
you're also making out the football we've played has been shit all season. it hasn't.
he isn't in the best of form right now but let's not make out he has been complete shite because up until a month ago that 8m was looking like a bargin.
[quote author=ILD link=topic=44931.msg1469472#msg1469472 date=1327375626]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. [/quote]
Scott Parker
Johann Cabaye
Both similar prices, both better players.
All that typed, I'm doing Chaz a bit of a disservice over the last couple of days on here. He's not that bad, and he's not been that bad. In fact he's a fairly decent midfielder who's had some good games for us, so there's not much to hate. He's good enough for a side fighting it out for 6th which is what we are.
He's not great though, and he never will be. It might just be a personal thing, but I really fucking detest players who feel the need to ping a 30 yard ball when there's an equally good option on 5 metres away. It adds nothing, and I fucking loathe looking at it. It's got to the stage now where I see him drawing his leg back and all I can do is reach for the bucket or the keyboard. Play it simple, retain the ball, move and receive. It's fundamental, but the best sides going around right now do it beest because they do it easiest. I long more than anything for a side and for players that are fluid in possession, comfortable on the ball, interchange with ease and can adapt to opposition, scorelines, and tactics with ease. I don't want a fucking Arsenal playing the ball around like they're going through 90 minutes of foreplay without ever wanting to fuck the thing, I just want good football and good footballers who9 can play, can win and allow me to fucking enjoy watching them.
For me, Adam (and it's shit to single him out I know when there are plenty of others alongside and even ahead of him in this queue) doesn't represent that, and never will. He's just annoying me.
[/quote]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
you're also making out the football we've played has been shit all season. it hasn't.
he isn't in the best of form right now but let's not make out he has been complete shite because up until a month ago that 8m was looking like a bargin.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469543#msg1469543 date=1327400768]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
[/quote]
Is right!
In Morse's Man of the Match table, Adam is currently 5th behind Suarez, Enrique, Lucas and Bellamy. 🙂
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
[/quote]
Is right!
In Morse's Man of the Match table, Adam is currently 5th behind Suarez, Enrique, Lucas and Bellamy. 🙂
[quote author=Portly link=topic=44931.msg1469549#msg1469549 date=1327401201]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469543#msg1469543 date=1327400768]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
[/quote]
Is right!
In Morse's Man of the Match table, Adam is currently 5th behind Suarez, Enrique, Lucas and Bellamy. 🙂
[/quote]Fucking wonderman holding on the top 5 like a MUN!! Even though hes had 11 games less than anyone else. MY HERO.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469543#msg1469543 date=1327400768]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
[/quote]
Is right!
In Morse's Man of the Match table, Adam is currently 5th behind Suarez, Enrique, Lucas and Bellamy. 🙂
[/quote]Fucking wonderman holding on the top 5 like a MUN!! Even though hes had 11 games less than anyone else. MY HERO.
am I the only person who looks at the thread title and sees 'drowning' in their mind?
guess I am 😛
guess I am 😛
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469543#msg1469543 date=1327400768]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469477#msg1469477 date=1327378899]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=44931.msg1469472#msg1469472 date=1327375626]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. [/quote]
Scott Parker
Johann Cabaye
Both similar prices, both better players.
All that typed, I'm doing Chaz a bit of a disservice over the last couple of days on here. He's not that bad, and he's not been that bad. In fact he's a fairly decent midfielder who's had some good games for us, so there's not much to hate. He's good enough for a side fighting it out for 6th which is what we are.
He's not great though, and he never will be. It might just be a personal thing, but I really fucking detest players who feel the need to ping a 30 yard ball when there's an equally good option on 5 metres away. It adds nothing, and I fucking loathe looking at it. It's got to the stage now where I see him drawing his leg back and all I can do is reach for the bucket or the keyboard. Play it simple, retain the ball, move and receive. It's fundamental, but the best sides going around right now do it beest because they do it easiest. I long more than anything for a side and for players that are fluid in possession, comfortable on the ball, interchange with ease and can adapt to opposition, scorelines, and tactics with ease. I don't want a fucking Arsenal playing the ball around like they're going through 90 minutes of foreplay without ever wanting to fuck the thing, I just want good football and good footballers who9 can play, can win and allow me to fucking enjoy watching them.
For me, Adam (and it's shit to single him out I know when there are plenty of others alongside and even ahead of him in this queue) doesn't represent that, and never will. He's just annoying me.
[/quote]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
you're also making out the football we've played has been shit all season. it hasn't.
he isn't in the best of form right now but let's not make out he has been complete shite because up until a month ago that 8m was looking like a bargin.
[/quote]
This.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469477#msg1469477 date=1327378899]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=44931.msg1469472#msg1469472 date=1327375626]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469067#msg1469067 date=1327315084]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469039#msg1469039 date=1327311674]
Is it a coincidence that Adam has been poor since Lucas has gotten injured?
[/quote]
And again - I pointed this out weeks ago. Not having Lucas around to carry him through games has showed him up fir the fairly average midfielder he is.
He's a 7/8M footballer, what can we expect really? Just a pity we didn't buy a better one for that money.
[/quote]
He is def. missing Lucas, as is the team. We wouldn't have got a better player than Adam for 7million though. [/quote]
Scott Parker
Johann Cabaye
Both similar prices, both better players.
All that typed, I'm doing Chaz a bit of a disservice over the last couple of days on here. He's not that bad, and he's not been that bad. In fact he's a fairly decent midfielder who's had some good games for us, so there's not much to hate. He's good enough for a side fighting it out for 6th which is what we are.
He's not great though, and he never will be. It might just be a personal thing, but I really fucking detest players who feel the need to ping a 30 yard ball when there's an equally good option on 5 metres away. It adds nothing, and I fucking loathe looking at it. It's got to the stage now where I see him drawing his leg back and all I can do is reach for the bucket or the keyboard. Play it simple, retain the ball, move and receive. It's fundamental, but the best sides going around right now do it beest because they do it easiest. I long more than anything for a side and for players that are fluid in possession, comfortable on the ball, interchange with ease and can adapt to opposition, scorelines, and tactics with ease. I don't want a fucking Arsenal playing the ball around like they're going through 90 minutes of foreplay without ever wanting to fuck the thing, I just want good football and good footballers who9 can play, can win and allow me to fucking enjoy watching them.
For me, Adam (and it's shit to single him out I know when there are plenty of others alongside and even ahead of him in this queue) doesn't represent that, and never will. He's just annoying me.
[/quote]
you're making out the adam has been shit all season. he hasn't.
you're also making out the football we've played has been shit all season. it hasn't.
he isn't in the best of form right now but let's not make out he has been complete shite because up until a month ago that 8m was looking like a bargin.
[/quote]
This.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469595#msg1469595 date=1327404024]
Read what I typed Neil, you idiot.
[/quote]
oooooooohhhhh!!!!!
Read what I typed Neil, you idiot.
[/quote]
oooooooohhhhh!!!!!
my post wasn't in response to your last post, just a succession of posts that give the general idea that we're shit, have been shit for most of the season and have shit players from top to bottom lead by someone who hasn't got the first clue what he's doing. don't take my word for it read some of your posts of the past two weeks, you'd think that we were *insert shit lower league team*
Re: Re: Re: Downing
[quote author=Delinquent link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327399553]
[quote author=Fascistio link=topic=44931.msg1469461#msg1469461 date=1327366079]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327360946]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469427#msg1469427 date=1327359958]
Do you think Lucas would be struggling if Charlie Adam fucked his knee?
[/quote]
Like when he played alongside Masher and more was asked of him offensively? It's a dumb point.
[/quote]
I get ryans argument.
Adam is noticibly struggling without lucas, would lucas struggle without adam? No, I doubt it
But then there's the flip side, adam is suffering due to increasing defending, restraining his attacking. would lucas be as bad if there was increased attacking impetus required from him, restraining his defending?
Again, I'd say no, as lucas is decent at attacking too.
But hey, I like lucas but am not sold on adam fully yet so I'm bias
[/quote]
Lucas is not decent at attacking, as evidenced by his total lack of goals and assists. Any time the onus has been on him to create (which was most of Rafa's last season when he assumed that Lucas could fill the void left by Alonso), he's been found wanting. I'm not having a go at him like, he's improved massively, and does the job of defensive midfielder much better than I ever thought he would. But he's virtually redundant as an attacking threat.
[/quote]
The time lucas was employed as an attacker was when he was 22 or younger, so I think it's harsh to rule out his attacking ability. This season he was a lot brighter and better going forward before he broke.
Completely agree over shelvey though
[quote author=Delinquent link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327399553]
[quote author=Fascistio link=topic=44931.msg1469461#msg1469461 date=1327366079]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44931.msg1#msg1 date=1327360946]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=44931.msg1469427#msg1469427 date=1327359958]
Do you think Lucas would be struggling if Charlie Adam fucked his knee?
[/quote]
Like when he played alongside Masher and more was asked of him offensively? It's a dumb point.
[/quote]
I get ryans argument.
Adam is noticibly struggling without lucas, would lucas struggle without adam? No, I doubt it
But then there's the flip side, adam is suffering due to increasing defending, restraining his attacking. would lucas be as bad if there was increased attacking impetus required from him, restraining his defending?
Again, I'd say no, as lucas is decent at attacking too.
But hey, I like lucas but am not sold on adam fully yet so I'm bias
[/quote]
Lucas is not decent at attacking, as evidenced by his total lack of goals and assists. Any time the onus has been on him to create (which was most of Rafa's last season when he assumed that Lucas could fill the void left by Alonso), he's been found wanting. I'm not having a go at him like, he's improved massively, and does the job of defensive midfielder much better than I ever thought he would. But he's virtually redundant as an attacking threat.
[/quote]
The time lucas was employed as an attacker was when he was 22 or younger, so I think it's harsh to rule out his attacking ability. This season he was a lot brighter and better going forward before he broke.
Completely agree over shelvey though
I would query the whole concept of a "defensive midfielder." I think it may be waste of a player. Defenders should be able to defend, and all midfielders should be able to both defend and attack. I suppose that's a bit old school.
When Rafa used to play Mascherano and Lucas together as twin defensive midfielders, we hardly ever won.
When Rafa used to play Mascherano and Lucas together as twin defensive midfielders, we hardly ever won.
[quote author=Portly link=topic=44931.msg1469641#msg1469641 date=1327407833]
I would query the whole concept of a "defensive midfielder." I think it may be waste of a player. Defenders should be able to defend, and all midfielders should be able to both defend and attack.
[/quote]
100% agree.
I would query the whole concept of a "defensive midfielder." I think it may be waste of a player. Defenders should be able to defend, and all midfielders should be able to both defend and attack.
[/quote]
100% agree.
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
We need to defend better in CM than we do at the moment. Protecting the area in front of defenders is a skill. However a single midfielder with defence focus is not the answer alone. Against good teams they all have to cover up areas for each other and put pressure on the opposition. Rafa was very good at this, and so is Mourinho. Not to mention Ferguson. His teams are very hard to break down as they cover each other all the way.
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
I don't think the fact that defensive midfielders are in vogue necessarily means they are the right way to go. Tactics go thorough various fashions. You may remember the craze for the catennacio defence with a libero or sweeper.
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
I don't think the fact that defensive midfielders are in vogue necessarily means they are the right way to go. Tactics go thorough various fashions. You may remember the craze for the catennacio defence with a libero or sweeper.
[quote author=Portly link=topic=44931.msg1469658#msg1469658 date=1327409005]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
I don't think the fact that defensive midfielders are in vogue necessarily means they are the right way to go. Tactics go thorough various fashions. You may remember the craze for the catennacio defence with a libero or sweeper.
[/quote]
That's true, but bucking the trend is not necessarily the way to go either. I think it's obvious how much we've missed Lucas.
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
I don't think the fact that defensive midfielders are in vogue necessarily means they are the right way to go. Tactics go thorough various fashions. You may remember the craze for the catennacio defence with a libero or sweeper.
[/quote]
That's true, but bucking the trend is not necessarily the way to go either. I think it's obvious how much we've missed Lucas.
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469661#msg1469661 date=1327409199]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[/quote]
Yaya really isn't THAT defensive either..
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[/quote]
Yaya really isn't THAT defensive either..
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469661#msg1469661 date=1327409199]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[/quote]
So buy better attackers.
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[/quote]
So buy better attackers.
[quote author=vikas link=topic=44931.msg1469662#msg1469662 date=1327409332]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469661#msg1469661 date=1327409199]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[/quote]
Yaya really isn't THAT defensive either..
[/quote]
He has Barry to cover for him, or dDe Jong from time to time. So he is a bit like Viera or the old Stevie G, who spent energy and power supporting his attackers.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=44931.msg1469661#msg1469661 date=1327409199]
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=44931.msg1469653#msg1469653 date=1327408530]
Can you point out the (good) teams that don't play with one?
Obviously you want all your players to be as good in all aspects as possible. But it's evidently essential to have a midfielder who's priority is to defend.
[/quote]
when the attackers are; silva, nasri, aguero etc then have yaya sit and contribute little going forwards is acceptable
when the attackers are; downing, carroll, henderson etc then have a holding midfielder contribute little going forwards isn't acceptable
in an ideal world our attackers would use the platform of a solid defense and holding midfielder to attack with impunity, alas it's not an ideal world.
[/quote]
Yaya really isn't THAT defensive either..
[/quote]
He has Barry to cover for him, or dDe Jong from time to time. So he is a bit like Viera or the old Stevie G, who spent energy and power supporting his attackers.
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