January Dealings

[keniget]

MacA, Endo, Szobo, Curtis, Elliot, Grav, Baj

I hope you’re sitting down.

We’re not signing a defender in the summer - we’ll use Van den Berg as our 5th defender (we’ll likely extend Matip on a reduced short term contract, though not register him, then make a call in January whether to re-integrate him or release.

You can’t keep signing more and more players on the basis of “someone might get injured”. Players needs to play consistently to build form - you can’t keep chopping and changing the team just to keep players happy - and if expensively signed players aren’t getting game time they get frustrated, they get called a failure because they’re not playing and then they often start causing disharmony - you can see the evidence of this everywhere.

Maybe a LB…. Probably a forward - we’re in a good spot.

Looking at it from a different angle, I think you can. If you have a bunch of injury prone players, in an ideal world you accommodate for that by ensuring there is sufficient backup or by selling one or more injury prone players over time and replacing them with less injury prone players.

 

[StevieM]

In the summer we will definately get one new striker, two if Mo doesn’t extend contract and, hence, moves on.

I don’t think Mo is leaving - I think he wants at least one more crack at the CL - he’ll do what he did this season - make it clear he’s committed and willing to stay - If we want to “cash in” the to that’s on us - and then he’ll leverage Saudi (or his agent will) to ensure if we want to extend we won’t get it on reduced terms.

That’s a tough one - all sorts of moving parts there.

 

[StevieM]

I'm absolutely certain we will - for the reasons given above.

We’ll replace him with Morton.

 

[Frogfish]

In the summer we will definately get one new striker, two if Mo doesn’t extend contract and, hence, moves on. Then it’s up to Juergen whether he sticks or twists with Joel

We have 5 now. Who else, Mo aside and that's a huge maybe, would be moved on? Not Nunez, Diogo or Gakpo (who Klopp loves). Diaz is the only possibility and I doubt Klopp agrees. Thiago and Matip (Stevie's suggestion that VdBerg will return is interesting, but doubtful, I think we'll sell him) will be the ones that need replacing and that's all I can see.

 

[Frogfish]

We’ll replace him with Morton.

I very much doubt it. I like Morton but that makes our midfield far too inexperienced.

 

[Beamrider]

I’ll defer to @Beamrider but my feeling is it’s not just about the transfer fee, it’s the wages - and we’ll be looking to offer Trent a bumper contract, Virgil reckons he can play atvtge highest level to his late 30’s, Curtis will be wanting a pay rise, then there’s Mo.

All that eats up ongoing income, so it needs to be managed - there’s limits as to how much we can pay in wages as a % of income.

You look at Arsenal - they’ve been able to do what they’ve done so far by developing youth fit long term success - but they’re in a bind now and the spending has to be stopped.

You’re right though - we need to… I mean… basically do what we’re doing - buy quality when we can, offer top wages for our best players to retain them and bring through kids that can either fill out the first team squad or drop straight profit onto the books when sold.

The headbangers struggle with nuance and reality - but we’re in a great position atvtge minute.

I did a quick analysis in another thread on the new FFP rule and we had capacity to spend at the end of May 2022 (last published accounts) under the new measure. But yes, incoming transfers or pay hikes for existing players would put stress on the ratio both in terms of extra wages and amortisation, both of which go straight onto the top half of the fraction.
By contrast, sales don't help that much under the new rules as they are assessed on a three year average (so you only get 1/3 of the benefit in the year of sale).
Our current year results will be down due to no Champions League but we are still in transitional periods on the new rules where the targets are more relaxed. And given how we're doing this year we should be confident of being in the CL next year, so by the time the ratio starts to tighten we should have a bigger bottom half of the fraction = stronger compliance.
So in short, if Klopp feels he needs to spend in this window, FFP shouldn't be a barrier and I think FSG would support him. But I don't think he'll panic buy or bring in anyone he doesn't really need.

 

[bluebell]

Heads will probably blow.. but replace Thuram with Morton and add Clark to the mix for RM & LM and I think you’ve got our midfield for next season.

Also - Badger can play in all positions too.

Why do you think Morton's ready for Prem 1st team? We know we're not selling anyone in the summer unless Salah says he wants to leave, so our budget will be around £50-70m. I can see Bobby Clarke getting more minutes, and probably buying a defender.

 

[StevieM]

MacA, Endo, Szobo, Curtis, Elliot, Grav, Baj


Looking at it from a different angle, I think you can. If you have a bunch of injury prone players, in an ideal world you accommodate for that by ensuring there is sufficient backup or by selling one or more injury prone players over time and replacing them with less injury prone players.

You could - but it’s risky - who do you sell that’s injury prone that will deliver a decent return - Gomez (now he’s fit), Badger, Jota, Konate - I wouldn’t sell any of them - but if they do hit bits of form, they need a route into the team - that’s were high performing u21’s come in - Quansah, Bradley, Harvey, Doak, Clark, Gordon, Badger all don’t need to be registered in the squad for at least another season (longer for most) - that’s gold.

 

[dee]

We have 5 now. Who else, Mo aside and that's a huge maybe, would be moved on? Not Nunez, Diogo or Gakpo (who Klopp loves). Diaz is the only possibility and I doubt Klopp agrees.

I think we should be in a position where we have 2 for each position. We dont have a natural backup for RWF, Harvey isn’t enough of a threat and Doak hasn’t really shown he’s going to be at the right standard even by next season. Both Diaz and Jota have had a go and done ok but they aren’t natural replacements. I’d be looking for a decent quality RWF to allow Mo to ease off a bit and extend his EPL lifespan.

 

[StevieM]

Why do you think Morton's ready for Prem 1st team? We know we're not selling anyone in the summer unless Salah says he wants to leave, so our budget will be around £50-70m. I can see Bobby Clarke getting more minutes, and probably buying a defender.

Why not - he’s clearly developed over his 2 years on loan, he’s playing at a higher level than Bradley did and he’s already looked decent when he integrated 2 years ago.

It’s up to him to take his chance - why wouldn’t you give him a chance?

 

[keniget]

You could - but it’s risky - who do you sell that’s injury prone that will deliver a decent return - Gomez (now he’s fit), Badger, Jota, Konate - I wouldn’t sell any of them - but if they do hit bits of form, they need a route into the team - that’s were high performing u21’s come in - Quansah, Bradley, Harvey, Doak, Clark, Gordon, Badger all don’t need to be registered in the squad for at least another season (longer for most) - that’s gold.

It's risky both ways and yeah it leads to tough decisions. We've stuck with our guys, which is a defendable decision to make but we've also been stung by it repeatedly where we've had injury crises or run players into the ground because there has been no alternative.

Gomez has historically been injury prone. Matip too. Konate gets niggles. Quansah as things stand remains unproven.

The fact that Gomez appears to be maturing into a great utility defender makes things a lot easier for us. He's kinda out of rotation for a starting CB role it would seem.

There is potentially a spot for another really good utility defender, if we can find one, or another very good CB to compete with Konate - depends on how good we think Quansah is, what happens with Matip and the plans for TAA going forward.

 

[StevieM]

Unless a player we have identified for the summer is approached by another team.

See Diaz and Spurs

I think it goes further than that - we do business when the deal structure suits us - which may be a release clause that reasonable (Slobbers, Mac Allister), clubs approach us with an opportunity to buy when we’ve indicated we’re interested (Gakpo, Diaz) or payment terms are extended (Jota) or we’ve been able to negotiate a reasonable fee without being raped (Gravvy, Konate).

Every now and then we’ll go nuts (Virgil, Alisson and it looks like we probs though Caicedo was one worth going nuts for).

City are similar - but you look at Uts & Chelsea as the opposite - they get taken to the cleaners every time they try to sign a player.

 

[StevieM]

It's risky both ways and yeah it leads to tough decisions. We've stuck with our guys, which is a defendable decision to make but we've also been stung by it repeatedly where we've had injury crises or run players into the ground because there has been no alternative.

Gomez has historically been injury prone. Matip too. Konate gets niggles. Quansah as things stand remains unproven.

The fact that Gomez appears to be maturing into a great utility defender makes things a lot easier for us. He's kinda out of rotation for a starting CB role it would seem.

There is potentially a spot for another really good utility defender, if we can find one, or another very good CB to compete with Konate - depends on how good we think Quansah is, what happens with Matip and the plans for TAA going forward.

Hence, the 6ft 4in Dutch defender playing well in the Bundesliga, who’s physically strong, fast, can play at FB or CB, isn’t injury prone and also shown he’s resilient enough to come back from a serious injury - also has a good work ethic, isn’t likely to spit the dummy at not being first choice and is also classified as Home Grown in England.

Did I mention he’s also available cheaply… as in… we already on him.

Not saying it’s happening - but I’m sure it’s under consideration and then we can can splurge on a forward.

 

[binomial]

Almiron off to Saudi it seems. Few reports out there reporting this (none of them much reliable).

Would make sense I guess with Newcastle needing to free up and who other than the Saudi's to help them out, although it's one of the clubs outside the PIF.

 

[tombrown]

2M on Linda is fine for me. Gives me time to rest between bouts.

*grabs a handful of blue pills for tom*

On reflection, you better setup an IV. And don't be expecting too much rest time.

 

[StevieM]

On reflection, you better setup an IV. And don't be expecting too much rest time.

Is this being videoed - asking for a friend.

 

[Modo]

I think we should be in a position where we have 2 for each position. We dont have a natural backup for RWF, Harvey isn’t enough of a threat and Doak hasn’t really shown he’s going to be at the right standard even by next season. Both Diaz and Jota have had a go and done ok but they aren’t natural replacements. I’d be looking for a decent quality RWF to allow Mo to ease off a bit and extend his EPL lifespan.

Left footed right winger and a CB to replace Matip, if he's not getting an extension. That's it imo.

 

[StevieM]

Almiron off to Saudi it seems. Few reports out there reporting this (none of them much reliable).

Would make sense I guess with Newcastle needing to free up and who other than the Saudi's to help them out, although it's one of the clubs outside the PIF.

Yep - watch the fee - bet it’s high.

 

[bluebell]

Why not - he’s clearly developed over his 2 years on loan, he’s playing at a higher level than Bradley did and he’s already looked decent when he integrated 2 years ago.

It’s up to him to take his chance - why wouldn’t you give him a chance?

We are not ever going to come close to breaching FFP, the way the club is run. We could afford to spend £100m in the summer and still be safe in the knowledge our head is above water
Tyler Morton has done well at Championship level, but is he ready for to take the move up? Thuram does not have the passing range of Morton who has Basquests vibe to him but he is faster, stronger and taller so gives more protection to the back 4 and can cover Trent when Trent bombs into the opposition 3rd.
It would be good to see what Morton does in the pre-season games even if Klopp does buy a CDM/CM, having options is always good. And with injuries and rotation is Morton is good enough je will get game time

 

[StevieM]

We are not ever going to come close to breaching FFP, the way the club is run. We could afford to spend £100m in the summer and still be safe in the knowledge our head is above water
Tyler Morton has done well at Championship level, but is he ready for to take the move up? Thuram does not have the passing range of Morton who has Basquests vibe to him but he is faster, stronger and taller so gives more protection to the back 4 and can cover Trent when Trent bombs into the opposition 3rd.
It would be good to see what Morton does in the pre-season games even if Klopp does buy a CDM/CM, having options is always good. And with injuries and rotation is Morton is good enough je will get game time

So what do you want to do - give Morton a chance or sign a perennial signing favourite.

There probably isn’t space for both and space for Badger & Clark.

 

[dmishra]

Left footed right winger and a CB to replace Matip, if he's not getting an extension. That's it imo.

As per Paul Gorst, the players we've been monitoring most closely are Ousmane Diomande and Morten Frendrup.

I expect we will go for a CB to replace Matip. Midfield not sure - I think Klopp may be willing to see what he has in Morton and Clark, before he spends on a midfielder again.

I think we might think about selling Tsimikas and getting in a younger LB. Maybe Ait-Nouri, especially since he's a Gestifute client, and we do business with them so often.

I'd definitely want another pacy forward though.

 

[tombrown]

Is this being videoed - asking for a friend.

Perfect footage to use as an insomnia cure

 

[bluebell]

So what do you want to do - give Morton a chance or sign a perennial signing favourite.

There probably isn’t space for both and space for Badger & Clark.

I wouldn't put my house on Morton being ready yet to move upto 1st team. I would probably happy to see him get prem game time at a PL club, like palace whilst on loan.
I would like to see someone bought in with top flight experience like Thuram. Now Morton could prove me wrong by performing in the preseason games, in which case he will have built a case to be included in the 1st team.

 

[moron]

Heads will probably blow.. but replace Thuram with Morton and add Clark to the mix for RM & LM and I think you’ve got our midfield for next season.

Also - Badger can play in all positions too.

So @StevieM - you do have fantasies and so does @Frogfish - as for @Modo comment on 8 players competing for 3 places - that is not the case - it's changed now - there will be different teams for different competitions and the big prizes of the PL/CL will mean subs at half time to ensure that we don't burn out our players and risk injuries.

In a Klopp system you need those 8 and it is what I alluded to. You could argue that we are quite desperate even now for 8, then we would not have to worry about Jones being out.

 

[Frogfish]

Almiron off to Saudi it seems. Few reports out there reporting this (none of them much reliable).

Would make sense I guess with Newcastle needing to free up and who other than the Saudi's to help them out, although it's one of the clubs outside the PIF.

Of course it makes sense - they only have 20 injured so far so may as well get rid of one the of the able bodied !

 

[Frogfish]

Perfect footage to use as an insomnia cure

As a horror film replacement for The Exorcist maybe.

 

[moron]

Of course it makes sense - they only have 20 injured so far so may as well get rid of one the of the able bodied !

Yeah - and this guy can run as well, that's insulting to their injury list.

 

[StevieM]

I wouldn't put my house on Morton being ready yet to move upto 1st team. I would probably happy to see him get prem game time at a PL club, like palace whilst on loan.
I would like to see someone bought in with top flight experience like Thuram. Now Morton could prove me wrong by performing in the preseason games, in which case he will have built a case to be included in the 1st team.

Is Thuram going to be happy starting off behind Endo, Mac Allister, Slobbers, Gravvy, Curtis & Harvey?l - he’d barely be making the bench.

Not much of a pathway into the team for Clarke, Badger or Morton.

I presume that means we’ve finally given up the idea that Trent’s going to play in Midfield and we’ve accepted that it’s best to use him as a RB that moves into a deep lying play maker role.

 

[StevieM]

So @StevieM - you do have fantasies and so does @Frogfish - as for @Modo comment on 8 players competing for 3 places - that is not the case - it's changed now - there will be different teams for different competitions and the big prizes of the PL/CL will mean subs at half time to ensure that we don't burn out our players and risk injuries.

In a Klopp system you need those 8 and it is what I alluded to. You could argue that we are quite desperate even now for 8, then we would not have to worry about Jones being out.

Next season we could already have Endo, Mac A, Badger, Slobbers, Gravvy, Curtis, Harvey, Clark, Morton and even potentially Carvalho, with Gakpo also capable of dropping in if required. As I mentioned, that’s even before we talk about Trent.

Now, “we might” look at another midfielder if we think Morton isn’t capable - my money would be on Klopp giving him a chance, or if we think a season loan for Clark is the best option, but again, he’s looking like he might be ready to step in.

I’d say, more likely, we won’t spend anything significant on midfield next season, pad it out with some good youth players and have a look the following season when we’ll likely have sapped all the juice out of Endo’s legs.

A CB seems more likely - but that too might depend on Van den Berg and whether we want to give him a shot after a successful loan.

LB seems a strong possibility, but that’s probably dependent on how Beck performs.

I think a forward is the most likely - and if we’re covering off elsewhere with tge kids we’ve developed - that means we can put all our resources into securing a top talent that we’d likely view as a long term replacement for Salah - although I’m not seeing him leave for another year at least.

 

[Brizzle]

As per Paul Gorst, the players we've been monitoring most closely are Ousmane Diomande and Morten Frendrup.

I expect we will go for a CB to replace Matip. Midfield not sure - I think Klopp may be willing to see what he has in Morton and Clark, before he spends on a midfielder again.

I think we might think about selling Tsimikas and getting in a younger LB. Maybe Ait-Nouri, especially since he's a Gestifute client, and we do business with them so often.

I'd definitely want another pacy forward though.

I really rate Ait Nouri