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VvDeclining

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Momo

Momo ★

If you take me seriously then you’re an idiot
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Earlier on in the season he looked like a man mountain. It feels like that is now declining. Over the past few weeks more and more errors are creeping in. A few times he’s coming for headers he doesn’t need, most notably the one against Man U for their goal.

His pace is going which is expected at 31. Last night he looked sluggish and generally tired. He’s isn’t helping himself still playing international football. I don’t get why players who want to prolong their careers still compete at that level in their 30s. Take those breaks to reenergise yourself.

He’s not been helped by having a brain dead partner or constant chopping and changing at full back. But this could appear to be the beginning of the end of our number four. I think this could well be the last season he’s our first choice CB. If it is, do we keep him round for another season and let him go on a free in 2027? Or would it be for a sale in the summer so he gets one last big deal?
 
He needs to call the boys round for another chat because the last one wet well
 
Well it was only a matter of time before we got round to Virg I suppose.

Probably mentally fatiqued from all the shit that surrounds him, which stems from our clueless manager. He's the one responsible for our defensive vulnerability, he's the one responsible for our lack of control in midfield and he's the one responsible for our lack of cohesion with our front 3. His lack of charisma and motivation gives us no chance to play with any meaning or intent. He needs to go.

One thing I will say about Virg though, don't want to hear anymore shit coming out his mouth post match about how "we need to do better", "we need to put things right", "our season starts now", "we need the fans behind us" and all this shit, do your talking on the pitch like the professionals you're supposed to be.
 
Kind of inevitable and noticeable on number of times he had a go at Kerkez. He has yet to develop trust or relationship on the left side too and that’s a big factor at present.
 
Mentioned it in yesterday's thread ...
Enjoy him like we enjoyed Salah last year ... as it's going to hurt watching a club legend declining in front of our eyes.
 
I'm gonna stick up for him a bit here actually. He was good earlier on in the season while Konate was fannying about. He's Milos Moreno on the other side of him making a show of himself too. He's obviously not going to be as good as he was 5 years ago, but he's still at a very high level. He was one of the few players actually acquitting themselves quite well. Agree regarding the international footy.
 
i personally think he/we need at least another adult in the back 4. thats a mature professional who can be trusted to do their job well and help others. it’s got to be mentally and physically draining keeping on top of other lads, bailing them out, wondering whether they’re going to do what you expect.

when there’s a settled, familiar, back 4 virgil can switch some of that off and concentrate more on his own game. ibou is sometimes an adult but not consistently, imo guehi could have been perfect.

with the new fullbacks and the out of form mess in front of him that doesn’t seem to offer a lot of protection, virgil at this age is going to struggle to carry us defensively.
 
We’re running him into the ground physically & mentally.

Needs rest. Needs our other leaders to step up.

But as i put in my thread, this is the worst version of VVD we have seen. Mostly because he’s been exceptional every other season.
 
Also put this in a Leoni thread at the time but it’s a shame that Leoni misses this year of learning from Virg on the training ground or on the pitch
 
All the other three positions at the back need to be doing far better. VVD is the least of our worries. Kerkez has been a huge disappointment, we've got interchanging sick notes on the right, and Konate is pretty thick and has too many ups and downs.
Basically VVD would still function perfectly if slotted into the defence of any other top team around the world. He is not the issue and has at the very least a couple more years in him.
 
A bit of copy/paste from sections I wrote in the Defence thread :

Virgil is not a worry and not the issue. You don't go from being superb a few weeks ago to showing obvious signs of being on the decline a few later. We seem to be looking left, right and over our shoulders to find issues and this is one that doesn't exist.

VvD - he's made some uncharacteristic errors however I wonder how much of that is down to the lack of stability in the team/overall defensive setup. He's still as dominant in most areas, heading, 1 on 1 etc, pace. I have no worries there. There isn't a CB that has ever lived that is/was not going to get beat on occasion.

As well as the midfield protection issue it seems to me that Salah is even worse than last season at tracking back, we're effectively playing a man short when defending the right which in turn stretches the midfield and defence leaving gaps. Gakpo isn't anywhere near as good as Diaz was on the other flank which means we have reduced protection from both flanks and in midfield.
 
My impression of it is that moving Dom deeper, and losing high intensity pressers like Nunez and Jota has meant opponents have more time to pick out meaningful + accurate balls into space behind that ridiculously high line of ours. Slot's not wrong in observing that we receive more long balls than anyone else in the league, but why wouldn't they exploit that high line when both VvD and Konate are well into the opponents' half, as we saw for Brentford's 2nd goal? In turn, the load on the two CBs has gotten higher, they're having to sprint back more than they're used to, starting to make mistakes and lose their duels. The only surprise is that Konate who's made of Weetabix hasn't broken down yet.

I suspect that once we lost our intensity in the press in the 2nd half of last season, it'll be hard to recover it.
 
juniormember said:
All the other three positions at the back need to be doing far better. VVD is the least of our worries. Kerkez has been a huge disappointment, we've got interchanging sick notes on the right, and Konate is pretty thick and has too many ups and downs.
Basically VVD would still function perfectly if slotted into the defence of any other top team around the world. He is not the issue and has at the very least a couple more years in him.
Click to expand...

I agree he is not **the** issue... but the fact that he is moving slowly from super super human / best CB the PL has ever seen into slightly more mortal (due to all the reasons everyone sees & knows) is why we also need to be ready to build the right people around him including someone who will ultimately replace him.

At this stage the only thing that is definitive is that no one knows who his CB partner will be next season, and that is a challenge in itself.
 
Dreambeliever said:
He can be here for a long time yet depending on our approach and who plays alongside him.
Click to expand...
Yup. As I said earlier, it's up to us to sort out the rest of the players. He's not the one for us to worry about, and it's not a good long term strategy to expect miracle work from your one centre back and goalkeeper forever. We need to improve as a team. He'll help others, if they're of the required quality.
 
I know we are all adults now (mostly) but the thought that in 18 months time we might have said goodbye to VVD, Ali, Robbo, Mo is almost a bit emotional. VVD is likely my all time favourite player (with Alonso), and Ali up there too as an ex wannabe GK.
 
www.bbc.com

Liverpool 1-1 Sunderland: Virgil van Dijk struggles for Reds again

Virgil van Dijk must not be written off - but he looks a shadow of his usual imperious self, writes Phil McNulty.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

Liverpool have been vulnerable in defence ever since head coach Arne Slot and the club's recruitment team embarked on a £450m summer refit that has yet to prove anything like value for money.

At the same time, Van Dijk has started to lose the air of invincibility he has carried since his £75m move from Southampton in January 2018.

Van Dijk has not been helped by defensive partner Ibrahima Konate's collapse in form, along with Milos Kerkez failing to settle at left-back. But the great Dutchman has also struggled badly, as proved by his panic-stricken handball that gave away a penalty in the heavy Champions League loss to PSV Eindhoven at Anfield.

It was encapsulated in the 67th minute on Wednesday when Chemsdine Talbi gave Sunderland a deserved lead, Van Dijk giving the ball away before standing off and turning his back on a 25-yard shot that struck him and drifted out of the reach of goalkeeper Alisson.

For a defender of such undoubted greatness, Van Dijk has an unusual habit of turning his back on the ball, sometimes to Liverpool's cost.

Ill fortune at the finale, yes, but it was a situation Van Dijk invited with his uncharacteristic failure to act decisively, Sunderland's Talbi capitalising.

Steph Houghton, the former England captain, told BBC Radio 5 Live: "Van Dijk gives the ball away and then he just drops off. It's the wrong decision. He needs to go to the ball. Him not making the decision means that no one else knows what to do."

Former Liverpool midfielder Jamie Redknapp added his voice to the criticism when he said on Sky Sports: "Virgil Van Dijk last season couldn't make a mistake. Every game he was imperious, but right now he's making mistakes and second-guessing himself."

As with Salah, a player of Van Dijk's pedigree must not be written off after winning two Premier Leagues, the Champions League, the FA Cup and two EFL Cups in a stellar Liverpool career.

He has, though, looked a shadow of his usual imperious self this season, with the worst recoveries per game during his Liverpool career, while tackles and interceptions are also down on last season.

And, while leadership should not be Van Dijk's preserve alone in a Liverpool team packed with experience, it was missing here. No-one was inspiring a team that once again looked lost to grab the game by the scruff of the neck.

Van Dijk's poor display, which ended with him being used as the desperate measure of acting as an emergency striker, was symptomatic of a horribly mediocre Liverpool performance - which made Sunday's win at West Ham seem like the exception rather than the rule.

======


View: https://x.com/ESPNFC/status/1996335414190166483

View: https://x.com/ESPNUK/status/1996557601023082716
 
He's not been his amazing best, but he's not been a car crash either - PSV game aside. But that's what happens when you don't create anything. The pressure mounts on the defence and any mistakes will get punished. If we'd gone in 2-0 at half time, the defence can relax a bit.
 
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