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Isakly what we need

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peterhague said:
Really? I don't think he comes across as very bright or very honest, tbh. Sounds to me like he wanted to stay at Leeds like Trent wanted to stay at Liverpool. He was either going to get paid more than Leeds could afford or leave on a free and rake it in somewhere else.
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He started slow, and I think that was him being rather guarded and trying to not step on toes. Once he got to tell his story, and was shown the Ridsdale and O'Leary interviews, I thought he loosened up because he clearly didn't like O'Leary.

Not saying he's being totally honest, I agree. Frankly, not for me to judge whether he was, since there's so much smoke and mirrors with all this stuff. I liked how he handled Kaveh Solhekol's attempts to portray Wissa in a better light than Isak at the end..
 
Hansern said:
Gakpo can't play as a winger but has 156 goals and assists in 222 games AS a winger.
His development has gone just fine and he's fucking good at it.
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I mean a winger. Not as one of a front three. He's suited for this system. The point isn't to insult gakpo or talk about him anyway, at another point in time he'd be a striker.
 
Gerry_A_Trick said:
Ah, it goes right back to underage. Makes sense.
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They do, but you can easily filter that out. As a left winger he has the following stats (youth excluded):

He has 89 G/A in 118 games for PSV
He has 33 G/A in 59 games for Liverpool

He's a fucking great left winger. The other notion but forward is beyond ridiculous in all seriousness.
 
bazazaba said:
He started slow, and I think that was him being rather guarded and trying to not step on toes. Once he got to tell his story, and was shown the Ridsdale and O'Leary interviews, I thought he loosened up because he clearly didn't like O'Leary.

Not saying he's being totally honest, I agree. Frankly, not for me to judge whether he was, since there's so much smoke and mirrors with all this stuff. I liked how he handled Kaveh Solhekol's attempts to portray Wissa in a better light than Isak at the end..
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I didn't watch to the end tbf - I agree the bit about Wissa he handled well.

I think the only reason Isak has ended up looking so bad is that it's dragged on so long and that's meant missing matches as well as just training - and that's basically Newcastle's fault for being so incompetent. The going on strike itself is pretty standard stuff these days.
 
Hansern said:
They do, but you can easily filter that out. As a left winger he has the following stats (youth excluded):

He has 89 G/A in 118 games for PSV
He has 33 G/A in 59 games for Liverpool

He's a fucking great left winger. The other notion but forward is beyond ridiculous in all seriousness.
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I don't think he could play a winger in a 4-4-2, the old school style of winger. At that point in the game of football, he would have been a striker, and he would have wanted to be a striker, is my point. It's obviously a completely theoretical bullshit point, but you're entirely missing what im trying to get at. I rate gakpo.

The fact that strikers are super valuable and in demand is not the aberation. The fact that for a hot minute we developed for one system at the expense of them is the aberation.
 
peterhague said:
Really? I don't think he comes across as very bright or very honest, tbh. Sounds to me like he wanted to stay at Leeds like Trent wanted to stay at Liverpool. He was either going to get paid more than Leeds could afford or leave on a free and rake it in somewhere else.
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I got the impression he knows how the media works, always looking for a soundbite or misquote, and was therefore being very careful. In the main, he used his personal circumstances to show how players can often be cast as villains when, in fact, it is never that straightforward. And, he carefully avoided Solhekol's preachy traps.

He also carefully addressed the "why not insist on the promise in writing ... " by asking back why anyone would promise anything to their top player if they didn't mean to honour it.
 
Latest from Paul Joyce: https://www.thetimes.com/sport/football/article/premier-league-transfer-news-xpnwg6r5k



Here is one way to see things: Newcastle are looking to lower Brentford's asking price for Wissa while we are looking to lower their asking price for Isak.

The fact Newcastle has a terrible window is a big reason there is "Isak saga." It is unfortunate really. I would've much strongly preferred we kept Diaz for another 2 years and gotten Isak next year.
 
mark1975 said:
I don't think Gapko wows everyone, but his output has been very good. If he put in those numbers for a rival we'd be wary of him, he's fine statistically if unspectacular on the eye. His goal last week was very good.
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He is useless on his left side. Useless. Can't dribble. All he does is take it to the right. He is very predictable. That goal last week was EKITIKE playing him on. Gakpo is also selfish as shit. Unlike Ekitike and Wirtz and Szoboszlai, and the whole NEW team spirit Liverpool is building now that TAA is out.

I was particularly impressed with how Wirtz played Ekitike on for that goal vs Crystal Palace in that Community Shield cup. Gakpo is not really good at that. He is very one-dimensional. A better version of Babel, another Dutch forward playing on the left that could only go to his right. But Gakpo is a bit better than Babel. Gakpo is a bit more of an all around striker. But when things get real and push comes to shove he is weak. Personally, I cannot B E L I E V E that Slot would prefer him OVER DIAZ just because he is Dutch. Diaz has a great motor and is more unpredictable and it would be great to have him in the squad now. But with Gakpo being preferred Diaz was insulted. IMO, Diaz was right to find himself insulted. Diaz was at the top of his game and career. It was terrible to see him offloaded to BM so that his career would die in Munich.
 
FullStop said:
He is useless on his left side. Useless. Can't dribble. All he does is take it to the right. He is very predictable. That goal last week was EKITIKE playing him on. Gakpo is also selfish as shit. Unlike Ekitike and Wirtz and Szoboszlai, and the whole NEW team spirit Liverpool is building now that TAA is out.

I was particularly impressed with how Wirtz played Ekitike on for that goal vs Crystal Palace in that Community Shield cup. Gakpo is not really good at that. He is very one-dimensional. A better version of Babel, another Dutch forward playing on the left that could only go to his right. But Gakpo is a bit better than Babel. Gakpo is a bit more of an all around striker. But when things get real and push comes to shove he is weak. Personally, I cannot B E L I E V E that Slot would prefer him OVER DIAZ just because he is Dutch. Diaz has a great motor and is more unpredictable and it would be great to have him in the squad now. But with Gakpo being preferred Diaz was insulted. IMO, Diaz was right to find himself insulted. Diaz was at the top of his game and career. It was terrible to see him offloaded to BM so that his career would die in Munich.
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Useless on the left? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
 
Dreambeliever said:
Useless on the left? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
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Just my opinion. Notice when he plays. Take a look. He always goes to his right and if he can't go to his right he struggles. And selfish like that too. Puts his head down. Predictable as s#it.

ps Salah also likes to go to his left. But, A. Players like Salah going to their left are rare. That is less common in world football. Something like left-handed pitchers in baseball. Randy Johnson comes to mind. Such football players tend to have greater opportunities. They are less predictable for the defenders. More unusual. And then B. Salah is Salah. He does other things. He has a great engine and speed and positioning. And has a knack for obtaining possession. Knows when and how to push the defender. Gakpo is way more limited. Way, way more.

 
FullStop said:
Just my opinion. Notice when he plays. Take a look. He always goes to his right and if he can't go to his right he struggles. And selfish like that too. Puts his head down. Predictable as s#it.
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You missed his goal then ya? Rightio. Or all the other worldies he has scored from the left.
 
I don't like Gakpo. I find him fundamentally limited. I think Diaz was better. Much better. Diaz was unpredictable and unreal with his engine. I couldn't believe that Liverpool didn't succeed at keeping him. Terrible work by Slot IMO. Slot is Dutch so he prefers Dutch players. Most terrible and primitive (In My Opinion). I think that Gakpo is a useful "tool." But just a tool. In contrast to him, Ekitike looks promising from the very early goings. It is very early goings but Ekitike looks much more promising.

My concern with Ekitike is his lack of technique. It is pretty obvious. He has great speed and all-around wherewithal. He seems unpredictable and in a good way. But he lacks a bit of a technique. That last goal he scored was a lucky bounce.

Diaz had better technique than both Gakpo and Ekitike (in my opinion). But with the greatest midfield in the world (Wirtz, Szoboszlai, Mac Allister, Gravenberch) one would hope Ekitike will get great service. Which is so far proving correct. We are loaded and there's no two ways about that. (Plus, Curtis Jones who is very useful).
 
Judge Jules said:
From the left is different from on the left. Gakpo does invariably move infield on to his right foot to do his best work.
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As does Salah moving infield from the left - managers actually seem to prefer wingers that come inside onto their stronger foot - which makes sense as the percentage of the target increases 😉
 
mark1975 said:
I don't think Gapko wows everyone, but his output has been very good. If he put in those numbers for a rival we'd be wary of him, he's fine statistically if unspectacular on the eye. His goal last week was very good.
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Exactly. His first touch isn't the silkiest, his dribbles look mechanical, and his passes are often not crisp enough, but his nose for scoring positions is great -- he backstabs sleeping defenders to death many times (what we call tap ins), and his finishing is pretty clinical. I've said before that after Jota (when fit), he was our most efficient scorer (Chiesa's sample size in a red shirt being too small).

He also has one of the fastest shot releases around -- there are times when I anticipate him taking a shot, but still find myself surprised at how quickly he got the ball off and how hard it was struck with little backlift.

Anyway, I'm glad he's on my team:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5btuu7KNbBE
 
We stole him from under the nose of United. I wasn't impressed with him initially when Klopp played him as a false 9. There were flashes, but he was not consistent enough.

He really came into his own on the left under Slot. He was surprisingly clinical even though he might look like he is bumbling around most of the time, he never stops trying to either score or create a progressive pass. We missed him when he got injured last season and if he could keep fit this season, he will provide loads of goals and assists.
 
Gakpo is all about efficiency. It's never exciting or spectacular, but give him space on the left wing and the space to cut it, or a Salah cross to the far post, and he's going to get the ball in the net. His general play can be slow, predictable and telegraphed, which does count against him, but his productivity outweighs it. I think he's going to have a good year. He finished last year strongly, and without Diaz, he should get a more settled run of games. There is a degree of stat-padding with his numbers coming in the Carling Cup, so I still think there's an element of proving himself further than he already has. I would like him finding new ways to impact games in general play, but also him to maintaining his output regularly in the PL/CL.
 
So there is a thread here entitled "Isakly what we need" and at the same time EKITIKE, who is our main Number 9 and who has already scored 2 goals in 2 games ACTUALLY playing for us, has no thread of his own. Like, WTF?
 
Farkmaster said:
Ok, we've all decided to miss the point then? Herding cats in here.
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It would probably help if you just presented an argument in a bit of detail.

For a start I'm not sure how persistent a problem the lack of strikers even is. I'm not saying it's not, I just don't know. It's only really been apparent to me this last year or so since we've needed one ourselves. I don't think it is but it could just be a coincidence that one generation of players was short on strikers. So we need to establish when it started manifesting to know what the environment was like at the time the changes can be traced to in terms of youth development.

And then let's say it is a problem of shifting to wide forwards then we need to examine those forwards like Gakpo who might otherwise have been strikers and if that number roughly accounts for the shortfall. And that's just one theory - there must be others - and then you need to think about WHY that bias existed in youth development to actually answer your question.

It's a complex issue - not sure why you'd expect other people to just generate theories and examine the data for you.
 
peterhague said:
It's a complex issue - not sure why you'd expect other people to just generate theories and examine the data for you.
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Hahahaha, you think that's what I thought was going to happen?

I just wanted a different flavour of bullshit bare assertions.

I think the role of a striker for a while was considerably more complicated than it used to be, and the role of the winger less specialized to work at the line without space. I don't know whether the overall talent is better or worse, but I do believe Gakpo in another era is a striker, as are many of the same sorts of inverted forwards, and because of that, in the aggregate, players with height, pace, and technical ability, are not now strikers as much as they would have been, and hence the market is worse.

It didn't require much imagination to think that strikers would be in demand once again.
 
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